Military Ramps

[Bob Keeshan]

How do military ramps work differently than GA ramps?

I take it that you won't see military aircraft using these unless you have them as aircraft add-ons? There is an ANG wing at an airport I'm working on. If I have, for example, an f-16 add-on aircraft, will that aircraft only use the military ramps?

I did notice an Airbus was using the military ramps too. So, how does FSX or ADE treat military ramps differently than GA ramps?

Thank you.

BK

[Golf-HotelDelta]

Unless you have added parking codes to your parking spots, any aircraft with a half wing span less than the parking spot radius will park there.

George

[rfields]

Military spots, GA spots and Cargo spots are all parking type RAMP

You can refine the atc_parking_types code with CARGO, MIL_COMBAT or MIL_CARGO - but they will still be ramp spots for overflow aircraft.

There is no way to EXCLUDE aircraft from a parking spot if the aircraft is smaller than the parking spot. Only to make it a less preferrable spot for that aircraft.

But the rule of adding parking to airports is that the airport must not be designed to match the real world.

It must be designed to match your AI flight plans.

If you have aircraft parking in the wrong area - you haven't put in enough parking for the AI traffic on your computer.

Also, if you want to setup the nice pretty lines on the ramp for drive through parking - expect your AI aircraft to not follow your planned setup.

[Bob Keeshan]

But the rule of adding parking to airports is that the airport must not be designed to match the real world.

It must be designed to match your AI flight plans.

This is interesting. So, how does one specify that an airport is a military-only airport? It doesn't sound like that is possible. However, I would think that MSFS would have something that tells it that non-military aircraft aren't allow to land/park at the airport.

[scruffyduck]

This is interesting. So, how does one specify that an airport is a military-only airport? It doesn't sound like that is possible. However, I would think that MSFS would have something that tells it that non-military aircraft aren't allow to land/park at the airport.

Presumably if all the AI flight plans for the airport in question involve military aircraft then no other type will arrive and depart.............

[jvile]

If you want a mixture of both Military and Civil AI Planes at the same airport then I suggest downloading my KSAV at

http://library.avsim.net/esearch.php?CatID=fsxafcad&DLID=103334

Open with ADE and study the parking codes/radius size in each Military parking spot vs the Parking of GA and Airliners.

Like Reggie says, you must have enough parking (plus overflow) of each available so a cascade effect does not start to happen.

To force a type plane into a spot you must also add a entry into each planes aircrfaft.cfg

Several examples for the Military at KSAV that park properly based on halfwing span


title=McDonnell-Douglas/Boeing DC-10 AI_USAF
atc_parking_types=GATE
atc_parking_codes=M002

title=Lockheed C-130E Hercules Camoflage
atc_parking_types=Mil_Cargo
atc_parking_codes=M003


Several examples for the Airliners at KSAV that park properly based on half wingspan

title=Boeing 737-700 AI_DAL_aia
atc_parking_types=GATE
atc_parking_codes=DAL

title=Airbus A320-200 AI_USA_NC_aie
atc_parking_types=GATE
atc_parking_codes=USA


So you match a Parking Spot radius to the Half wingspan
Set a parking type/code and have some overflow
Add a few more parking spots so no cascading begins. It only takes one wrong type plane to park where it should not to cascade the whole airport at of whack.

[Bob Keeshan]

So you match a Parking Spot radius to the Half wingspan
Set a parking type/code and have some overflow
Add a few more parking spots so no cascading begins. It only takes one wrong type plane to park where it should not to cascade the whole airport at of whack.

Jim,

Thanks again for your help with this. So, if I was creating parking for F-16s that have a wingspan of 32ft 8in, I would create a military_combat ramp with a radius of 17 ft. I would also need to make changes to the F-16 aircraft file to also limit their parking ability to military parking.

Thanks.

BK

[jvile]

Lets see, 32ft 8in is what the wingspan should be in the F-16 aircraft.cfg file correct?

divide by half gives us 16.4 converted to Meters is 4.99872.

We normally roundup to the whole meter value. For testing I would set the parking spot to 5.1 - 5.5 Meter

Type Parking Spot will be RAMP_MIL_COMBAT

Down arrow on All Airlines list in the parking spot property window and go toward the bottom and find Mil F16. Highlight that line and hit the "+" button to the right which will set the parking Code to F16 in the Codes window.

Now that gets the parking spot setup in ADE.

Open your F16 aircraft.cfg and add the 2 lines to the [fltsim.X] sim section for that particular plane

atc_parking_types=RAMP_MIL_COMBAT (matches what ADE has)
atc_parking_codes=F16 (matches what ADE has)

When the F-16 lands it starts looking for a parking space that the half wingspan will fit into. It then also looks at the parking codes for both the Parking spot and what you put into the Aircraft.cfg.

This will tell your AI to park in a RAMP_MIL_COMBAT
with a parking Code that says the F16 code is a match in 2 places.

If the parking spot is occupied then the F16 will look for the next one on the list (code more then one parking spot and always give yourself a extra if needed). If none exsit then the F16 starts to cascade looking for anything Meter wise it can park into. If nothing exsit at all the F16 disappears from the runway before it exits.

If you are flying the F16 as a user plane and no parking space exsit then ATC ground tells you to leave and no parking option is listed in the ATC window. You might get the Fuel Station if you are lucky.

[kagazi]

I've often wondered! I thought it was a fluke that I wasn't offered a parking spot...only an exit runway! :) I knew the part about the ai, it was explained quite nicely by Burkhard Renk and now by you. But the user part is news to me, thank you.

This forum is an amazing resource, we're lucky to have it.

kagazi

[Bob Keeshan]

I've often wondered! I thought it was a fluke that I wasn't offered a parking spot...only an exit runway! :)

Thank you for landing. Now get on outta here!

Too funny...

[Mace]

A good illustration of this problem (some RAMP type aircraft parking on MIL spots) would be at my KSTL v1.1, in which I, to my chagrin, have a MIL_CARGO spot at 26.1m.

Do you know what this does/means?

It means that if you land at my KSTL with a DC-10 or MD-11 (both very common cargo haulers) that have atc_parking_types=CARGO, then you'll get vectored to the MIL_CARGO 26.1m spot, smack dab in the middle of the Missouri Air National Guard apron.

Not what I wanted.

I intended that spot for C-130's and similar mil aircraft. What you (or I) would need to do to fix, would be to set up a CARGO type parking spot of 26.1m up in the St. Louis Cargo apron. Or alternatively change the mil spot to a radius away from DC-10 size. That "should" do it.

I need to upload an ADE/AFX/FSXPlanner-friendly version so that users can make these mods themselves without destroying <SceneryObjects> and other functionality in the omnibus bgl's I was creating.

[Bob Keeshan]

Lets see, 32ft 8in is what the wingspan should be in the F-16 aircraft.cfg file correct?

divide by half gives us 16.4 converted to Meters is 4.99872.

We normally roundup to the whole meter value. For testing I would set the parking spot to 5.1 - 5.5 Meter

Type Parking Spot will be RAMP_MIL_COMBAT

Down arrow on All Airlines list in the parking spot property window and go toward the bottom and find Mil F16. Highlight that line and hit the "+" button to the right which will set the parking Code to F16 in the Codes window.

Now that gets the parking spot setup in ADE.

Open your F16 aircraft.cfg and add the 2 lines to the [fltsim.X] sim section for that particular plane

atc_parking_types=RAMP_MIL_COMBAT (matches what ADE has)
atc_parking_codes=F16 (matches what ADE has)

When the F-16 lands it starts looking for a parking space that the half wingspan will fit into. It then also looks at the parking codes for both the Parking spot and what you put into the Aircraft.cfg.

This will tell your AI to park in a RAMP_MIL_COMBAT
with a parking Code that says the F16 code is a match in 2 places.


Hey, Jim, I tried this with my F16 (Kirk Olsson version) and I still get directed to general aviation parking. Not quite sure why this is happening.

Here are the specs on the aircraft from the config file:

title=VIPER vc
sim=VIPER
model=1
panel=
sound=
texture=
checklists=
description=F-16 Fighting Falcon ---by Kirk Olsson---
ui_manufacturer=Lockheed Martin
ui_type=F-16 viper (USAF)
ui_variation=Clean (Virtual Cockpit Friendly)
atc_heavy=0
atc_id=94
atc_airline=Air Force
atc_flight_number=
atc_type=LOCKHEED
atc_model=F16
atc_parking_types=RAMP_MIL_COMBAT
atc_parking_codes=F16

[I put the last two in based on your comments above]

I checked the wingspan on this model and it is below:

[airplane_geometry]
wing_area= 300.00
wing_span= 33.00

I setup the parking for the airport as Type: RAMP_MIL_COMBAT, Radius: 16.99, Codes:F16

Any thoughts on why I'm not being directed to these spots?

[jvile]

Are you flying the F16 or is it a AI Plane? If you are flying the F16 Plane then there are some added steps required to get ATC to park you correctly. But lets first make sure of the following.

I setup the parking for the airport as Type: RAMP_MIL_COMBAT, Radius: 16.99, Codes:F16

Radius is set to 16.99 ft and not 16.99 Meter correct?

33 ft Wing Span = 16.5ft rounded to 17ft.

Parking spot size should be 17ft or 5.18M rounded up to the next whole number of 6.0 Meter. Use settings in ADE and change Meter to Ft (check) and back again (check) to confirm the correct size parking spot.


general aviation parking

What did you use for parking name in the ADE parking spot?

[ugo1]

Hi

I'm confused on a parameter in the aircraft.cfg file. The line atc_parking_types= must be:

1- atc_parking_types=RAMP_MIL_COMBAT

or

2- atc_parking_types=MIL_COMBAT

Regards

Ugo

[jvile]

Ugo

It must be RAMP_MIL_COMBAT for Jet type fighter planes and RAMP_MIL_CARGO for other type Military.

I have never seen a MIL_COMBAT and it is not in the list of the SDK. Do you see it listed somewhere?

[Bob Keeshan]

Radius is set to 16.99 ft and not 16.99 Meter correct?

33 ft Wing Span = 16.5ft rounded to 17ft.

Parking spot size should be 17ft or 5.18M rounded up to the next whole number of 6.0 Meter. Use settings in ADE and change Meter to Ft (check) and back again (check) to confirm the correct size parking spot.

Jim,

The radius is set to 16.99 ft. I originally used 17, but for some reason, ADE changes it to either 17.01 or 16.99. I went back and made it larger (20ft), but that didn't seem to make a difference.

What did you use for parking name in the ADE parking spot? I kept the default name, parking.

And yes, I was flying the F16 myself to check where ATC would park me.

[jvile]

All PARKING code NAMES and RAMP will always say taxi to General Aviation.

Only if you use a GATE or GATE_letter will ATC say taxi to Gate. Many Military guys set a Gate_M for military so it sounds more professional then having a DC10 being instructed to taxi to General Aviation.

Now the next question

Are you flying the F16 or is it a AI Plane?

[Bob Keeshan]

All PARKING code NAMES and RAMP will always say taxi to General Aviation.

Only if you use a GATE or GATE_letter will ATC say taxi to Gate. Many Military guys set a Gate_M for military so it sounds more professional then having a DC10 being instructed to taxi to General Aviation.

Thanks, I will try this fix tonight. In my case, though, ATC was directing me to a non-military parking spot, or truly general aviation.

Now the next question

Are you flying the F16 or is it a AI Plane?

Yes, I was flying the F-16 myself.

[jvile]

ATC was directly me to a non-military parking spot, or truly general aviation.

Yes, I was flying the F-16 myself.

At this point because you are flying the plane as a User airplane all the rules change. Parking codes in the aircraft.cfg and in ADE are more of a qualifier for AI type planes and not the USER plane. This is not to say we can never park where we want but we have to use some priority coding for ATC to understand we are the User Plane and not a AI plane.

It would have been nice and we have asked many times for MS to honor a parking for the User plane just like the AI but that has not happened yet.

I have sent Reggie a PM to come in on this here and give us all the fundamentals on how to force ATC to park a User properly. Reggie has done extensive studies since FS2002 in parking behavior and has defined all the qualifiers for both the AI and User Parking.

Before anyone else jumps in here and says "well ACES says this or that" let me quote the SDK's.

Q: Is there a limit to the number of aircraft present at an airport ?

A: Yes. Airport traffic is limited by the number (and size) of parking spaces available at the airport. The largest parking space of each type (ramp, cargo, gate, etc.) is always reserved for the user aircraft and the rest may be allocated to AI traffic.

These type SDK statements can be very misleading. First they are based on FP's that are generated with the MS TrafficDatabaseBuilder.exe (TDB) compiler and not what everyone uses called TTools designed by Lee Swordy who also gave us AFCAD.

We can pretty much throw out that rule because even with TDB FP's all qualifiers for parking must be weighted properly for it to work.

Its the holidays and Reggie spends a lot of time with Family/Grand Children. I am asking you to wait a few days until he is available so I don't say something that contradicts the actual qualifiers that ATC uses.

[ugo1]

Ugo

It must be RAMP_MIL_COMBAT for Jet type fighter planes and RAMP_MIL_CARGO for other type Military.

I have never seen a MIL_COMBAT and it is not in the list of the SDK. Do you see it listed somewhere?

I thought that the code to put in the line was unchanged from fs9...........:banghead:

Thanks for the clarification

Ugo

[Reider]

It sounds like I could use this coding to make AI helicopters land on the heli pads at my re configured EGCB Barton Manchester. At the moment they`re doing a wonderful job following my traffic pattern in and out. But spoiling things by parking with the light planes as GA traffic. I have at least two areas I wish them to park instead, as per an aerial photograph I`m using as my template.

Reider
________
K75 (http://www.cyclechaos.com/wiki/BMW_K75)

[rfields]

Ugo,

MIL_COMBAT comes from the Aircraft SDK and goes in the aircraft.cfg / fltsim.n / atc_parking_types= line. The allowable entires in FSX and FS2004 are:

RAMP
CARGO
GATE
DOCK
MIL_CARGO
MIL_COMBAT

The RAMP_MIL_COMBAT comes from the BGLComp SDk and goes in the TaxiwayParking node properties. The allowable entries in FSX are:

NONE
DOCK_GA
FUEL
GATE_HEAVY
GATE_MEDIUM
GATE_SMALL
RAMP_CARGO
RAMP_GA
RAMP_GA_LARGE
RAMP_GA_MEDIUM
RAMP_GA_SMALL
RAMP_MIL_CARGO
RAMP_MIL_COMBAT
VEHICLE

Forget FUEL and VEHICLE for this discussion.

GATE means GATE_HEAVY, GATE_MEDIUM, GATE_SMALL in no priority (size/radius is what's important)

DOCK means DOCK_GA

CARGO means RAMP_CARGO - then all the other ramp types in no priority, then Gate or Dock or None in no priority - size again the overwhelming factor

MIL_CARGO means RAMP_MIL_CARGO - then all other ramp types in no priority, then the other types

MIL_COMBAT means RAMP_MIL_COMBAT - then all the other ramps types in no priority, then the other types

RAMP means all the ramp types in no priority. If the parking spots are equal size - an aircraft with RAMP in the ATC_PARKING_TYPES= line will park in a MIL_CARGO or CARGO spot over a RAMP_GA spot if it is higher up the list of parking spots.

AI aircraft will be assigned to FUEL parking spots if their size matches the spot size.

I suspect, but have not tested, that AI might be assinged to VEHICLE spots is the size is correct - another thing to test - though if vehicles are loaded before AI, the vehicle spots will all be previously filled.

[rfields]

It sounds like I could use this coding to make AI helicopters land on the heli pads at my re configured EGCB Barton Manchester. At the moment they`re doing a wonderful job following my traffic pattern in and out. But spoiling things by parking with the light planes as GA traffic. I have at least two areas I wish them to park instead, as per an aerial photograph I`m using as my template.

Use a custom parking code for such situations.

In the config - atc_parking_codes=HELO

In the parking spot properties - use HELO as the airline code.

That way if you ever see a helo in a GA spot, you know you don't have enough HELO spots setup.

[rfields]

The radius is set to 16.99 ft. I originally used 17, but for some reason, ADE changes it to either 17.01 or 16.99.

Rounding is why I never set parking in feet and why I always set parking slightly larger - i.e. 17.1M

If an aircraft half wing span value converts to 16.00001M - FS will not allow it to be parking an any spot which is not 17.0M or larger.

For an F-16 the aircraft.cfg wing_span= value should be 32.67

That requires a parking spot radius value of 5.0M - preferably 5.1M

If the wing_span=value is 33.00 - that requires a parking spot radius value of 6.0M or larger.

Again, please do not use FEET to set parking spot sizes. FS does not and the rounding is a big issue.

To FS the aircraft parking need is always a whole meter value. The parking spot is always in whole meter values:

15 ft = 4.0M aircraft or smaller
16 ft = 4.0M aircraft or smaller
17 ft = 5.0M aircraft or smaller
18 ft = 5.0M aircraft or smaller
19 ft = 5.0M aircraft or smaller
20 ft = 6.0M aircraft or smaller

4.0M aircraft must have a wingspan value no larger than 26.17
5.0M aircraft must have a wingspan value no larger than 32.75
6.0M aircraft must have a wingspan value no larger than 39.33

Here is what I recommend - set your flyable aircraft wingspan value to 32.67.

Set the desired parking spots to 5.1M size. Set the AI parking codes to F16. Make sure the spots are RAMP_MIL_COMBAT

Make sure the atc_parking_types entry in the aircrft.cfg is MIL_COMBAT - this had no impact in FS2004, but we don't really know in FSX.

Make sure you have no other parking spots on the airport smaller than 6.0M

Test

Let us know the results

With FS2004 - the key to user aircraft parking was to make the preferred parking spot so small and so low in the AI parking order that the user aircrft would be assigned to the spot.

[Bob Keeshan]

For an F-16 the aircraft.cfg wing_span= value should be 32.67

That requires a parking spot radius value of 5.0M - preferably 5.1M

If the wing_span=value is 33.00 - that requires a parking spot radius value of 6.0M or larger.

For simplicity sake, I left the wingspan at 33 ft. However, I adjusted all my military parking spaces to 6 meters. (I find it interesting that MSFS uses feet in the aircraft config file, but you're saying it uses meters in the airport files.)

Set the desired parking spots to 5.1M size. Set the AI parking codes to F16. Make sure the spots are RAMP_MIL_COMBAT

Make sure the atc_parking_types entry in the aircrft.cfg is MIL_COMBAT - this had no impact in FS2004, but we don't really know in FSX.

Make sure you have no other parking spots on the airport smaller than 6.0M

I think changing the atc_parking_types from ramp_mil_combat to just mil_combat is what worked. My parking radii were all okay to begin with.

Now, when I land, I'm still directed to "general aviation parking," [which Jim explained previously why] but am given directions to the military parking areas. To check, I also landed several other types of aircraft, and they were all directed to the true general aviation parking.

Thanks for your help.

[jvile]

(I find it interesting that MSFS uses feet in the aircraft config file, but you're saying it uses meters in the airport files.)

So do we.

Now, when I land, I'm still directed to "general aviation parking," [which Jim explained previously why] but am given directions to the military parking areas.

Looks like you are getting there now. If you don't like what ATC says just change the ADE parking spot to a GATE_Letter such as Gate_M and a number

Change the .cfg to GATE also.

I don't like ATC to tell me to taxi to General Aviation when landing a heavy military cargo type or P3 plane at Jax NAS.

[rfields]

(I find it interesting that MSFS uses feet in the aircraft config file, but you're saying it uses meters in the airport files.)

The 'world' tends to be meters in FS and the aircraft tend to be 'feet'.

It might possibly go as far back as SimLogic - where the first aircraft were totally feet in measurements. I've been told that the .air file is still based on much of the original SimLogic engine.

There didn't exist a world as such back then. As the world has developed, meters has been the only real choice because so much of the world is measured in meters.

[FlyEF]

FSX SDK SP2 says:

atc_parking_types:
Specifies the preferred parking for this aircraft, used by ATC. If this line is omitted, ATC will determine parking according to the type of aircraft and parking available. If multiple values are listed, preference will be given in the order in which they are listed. The valid values may be one or more of the following: RAMP, CARGO, GATE, DOCK, MIL_CARGO, MIL_COMBAT.
Aircreation582SL( atc_parking_types=RAMP )
Boeing 747-400( atc_parking_types=CARGO )
de Havilland Dash 8-100( atc_parking_types=GATE,RAMP )

Horst

[jvile]

Specifies the preferred parking for this aircraft, used by ATC. If this line is omitted, ATC will determine parking according to the type of aircraft and parking available.


Horst

The rules you are reading in the aircraft confiquration doc is based on other SDK's that also must be studied. Too many times the SDK that we read does not tell you that the rule is based on using the rules of other companion SDK's in this case the TrafficDatabaseBuilder.exe.

The TDBB must also have the following

typeKey,Title,Cruise,minAlt,maxAlt,minRange,maxRan ge,minRwyLen,runwayTypes, radius,parkingTypes,IFR%,AutoRoute?,TouchAndGo?

# Examples

BE58,Beech Baron 58,200,40,120,50,661,4000,HARD,7,RAMP,50,yes,no

B350,Beech King Air 350,315,150,250,100,1298,4000,HARD,11,RAMP,75,yes, no

B734-0,Boeing 737-400,477,250,350,200,2248,6426,HARD,22,GATE,100,yes ,no

parkingTypes = RAMP|CARGO|GATE|DOCK|MIL_CARGO|MIL_COMBAT (one or more)

which then the aircraft.cfg is a companion of code order to the FP's compiled with the use of TDBB.

If the aircraft.cfg omitts, certain lines ATC will determine parking according to the type of aircraft and parking available because it is coded in the TDBB.

How many Flightplans are available that used the TDBB and not TTools by Lee Swordy?

The TTools FP compiler does not follow all the rules of the TDBB so what we read in the aircraft confiquration docs may not be the exact same set of rules we have to use for parking.

[Reider]

Use a custom parking code for such situations.

In the config - atc_parking_codes=HELO

In the parking spot properties - use HELO as the airline code.

That way if you ever see a helo in a GA spot, you know you don't have enough HELO spots setup.

Nice one, many thanks, working on an airfield at sea for the acceleration carrier just now (long story), so I`ve put this in a text file for when I resume it.

Reider
________
herbal vaporizers (http://vaporizers.net/)

[rfields]

Specifies the preferred parking for this aircraft, used by ATC.

Here is the problem with that part of the SDK.

Those atc_parking_types do not match exactly the parking spot type properties in the BGLComp SDK. Consolidation of the different parking spot types occurs with the aircraft.cfg value equal to more than one type of BGLComp parking spot property.

The values we use in the aircraft.cfg work great for the first type or parking spot - as long as it is not RAMP

The big problem with RAMP is that RAMP_CARGO, all the Ramp GA and Ramp MIL work exactly the same.

When the parking spots are the same size - FS2004 and FSX cannot tell them apart.

So it is very easy to get the default PA-28 Archers with atc_parking_types=RAMP parking in RAMP_MIL_COMBAT spots which are sized for F-16 or F-18 fighters - because the parking spot size is smaller than the RAMP_GA_SMALL spot.

A lot of people like to use: atc_parking_types=GATE,RAMP

because it appears in default aircraft.

That setting is not really for parking - but for the automated generation of AI flight plans for default aircraft. Because many of the smaller airports served by regional aircraft do not have GATE parking by default.

GATE,RAMP when applied to airport design using the BGLComp SDK standards means:

1. Use any available GATE spots close to the aircraft size parking value;
2. Use any other spot on the airport based on size of the parking spot as long as it is not DOCK or NONE.

Since there are no default DOCK or NONE parking types in FS2004 and FSX - we don't see the impact.

Since there are a few RAMP_MIL_COMBAT and RAMP_MIL_CARGO spots in FS2004 - but none in FSX - we don't see the impact.

With the default FS2004 parking spot sizes of:

RAMP_GA_SMALL - 10M
RAMP_GA_MEDIUM - 14M
RAMP_GA_LARGE - 18M
RAMP_MIL_COMBAT - 26m
RAMP_MIL_CARGO - 44M

What appears to be RAMP moving regional turboprops and jets into RAMP_GA_LARGE spots is really occuring because of the size of the default parking spot.

If you change some spot types size value - the apparently good system falls apart. You quickly find that the size of the parkign spot and it's placement on the list / order determines which aircraft park where.

What you will see occur in FSX with the GATE_SMALL set to 18M and RAMP_GA_LARGE set to 18M is B737 and A320 sized aircraft parking in RAMP_GA_LARGE spots even though they have GATE only in the atc_parking_types entry.

One other factor which has a HUGE impact on parking is load order.

When a traffic/flight plan file loads - the first aircraft in the file are placed on the airport, then the next, then the next, etc.

Most people order their flight plans with the smallest aircraft first. This masks a great many parking issues by causing aircraft to overflow into larger spots of the same type.

If you reverse the order of the aircraft in the flightplans.txt file - the heavies first, then the mediums, then the smaller jets - you see quickly where there is not sufficient parking.

This load order effect occurs even more when separate traffic files are used.

If you have:

Traffic_AAL_xxxx.bgl
Traffic_COA_xxxx.bgl
Traffic_DAL_xxxx.bgl
Traffic_NWA_xxxx.bgl
Traffic_UAL_xxxx.bgl
Traffic_USA_xxxx.bgl

All the American aircraft are placed, then all the Continental, then all the Delta, then Northwest, then United then US Airways. "My US Airways aircraft are not parking correcty - they are in cargo and GA spots" when the problem is almost always one of the other airlines.

We really saw this effect early in FS2004 at KATL - because AAL and COA took all the available parking spots - and "There are no Delta aircraft at KATL - what's wrong with your flight plans"

The order in which aircraft/ airlines are placed in the sim is very important - especially regional carriers, military and GA aircraft - because they are most likely to contend for the same parking spots.

[adr179]

Here's a little, tiny contribution from me: since I needed to produce two divine airports and make some AI traffic to visit them (and it's military traffic and A/C are single engined TP - PC9's),I decided to do some testing. On airport B I made 9 parking spots that were RAMP_MIL_CARGO and coded themPC7 that 's listed and on airport A I made only one spot, then I made one single flight from A to B and back - no way, no compile, eror was "cannot find parking spec on airport A", so I made another spot on A and tried again - same result. Only when I made the third parking spot at airport A, compiler stopped nagging and produced a bgl. With increase of positions this percentage probably drops off and is not so dramatic, but in case of small airports with, say 10 parkings, it's good to know.

[jvile]

no way, no compile, eror was "cannot find parking spec on airport A",

What Flightplan compiler did you use?

[adr179]

I was using(as far as I know, the latest) version 1.3.0.1 of AISort that nicelly lists the compiler output in TBldr.txt.
Actual output of error mentioned in my previous post looks like this: error: Unable to find available parking at LJLJ for Pilatus PC9-M L9-64.

In the mean time I'm expanding my traffic to more flights (six) and I'll have 8 dedicated positions on A and 7 on B to see what will happen.

Interestingly enough this last combination (6 flights from 8 parkings to 7 parkings) compiled without any problem. I do still have tho troublesome file in backup and will
again double check them for errors, even if I already did before first posting.