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Bad idea to reposition airport?

#1
Should updated default airports be moved to correct position, or will that confuse ATC and other pilots when on line?

For example I found LFQQ ARP coordinates 600 meters off to the north in the default scenery compared to real life when fiddling with it's incorrect taxiways, parkings and aprons. I don't know what freeware scenery designers or payware designers do. Nor what the community thinks is workable.

Tommy
 
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#2
If you move an airport, all online users will have to have a copy of that airport or they will see only the default one.
 
#3
If you move an airport, all online users will have to have a copy of that airport or they will see only the default one.
And if they have addon airports as well by France Vfr or Aerosoft or freeware, how would they be positioned? Incorrectly like the default airport?

Ultimately: Should we try to change the world for the others to join, or should we stay in darkness because of a default majority?
 
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#4
Tommy,

To be just a little more specific, if you move just the ARP, the airport scenery itself (runways, taxiways, buildings, etc) do not move with it unless you have prokey and use the Tools/Move Airport function in the toolbar. Then everything moves to the new location. So, if you are just moving the ARP people will see no difference.

From your post, though, it sounds like you are adjusting taxiways, runways, etc to match the real world location. Then, as Rick already said, people with a different airport scenery that has not been realistically located, whether default, freeware, or payware, will see you in a different spot than their airport. To them you will look as if you are taxiing on grass or in trees or through buildings, depending on what is around LFQQ.

Randy
 
#5
Tommy,

To be just a little more specific, if you move just the ARP, the airport scenery itself (runways, taxiways, buildings, etc) do not move with it unless you have prokey and use the Tools/Move Airport function in the toolbar. Then everything moves to the new location. So, if you are just moving the ARP people will see no difference.

From your post, though, it sounds like you are adjusting taxiways, runways, etc to match the real world location. Then, as Rick already said, people with a different airport scenery that has not been realistically located, whether default, freeware, or payware, will see you in a different spot than their airport. To them you will look as if you are taxiing on grass or in trees or through buildings, depending on what is around LFQQ.

Randy
Thanks for your comment.
Yes, I have the ProKey and considered moving the whole lot. And that is my concern: What do other scenery makers do when "professionally" remaking an airport? If they all adjust to the defaujlt airports of FSX there will be misplaced taxiways, missing taxiways and runways in wrong direction. I have a feeling some of the default aspects of the scenery is tampered with and some are kept. In many cases the differences are not that big. So - I realize that parking positions and taxiway designators are OK/are necessary to adjust and can be kept for myself for my taxiing needs when directed by ground ATC f.e. But should missing taxiways, maladjust tower positions and runway headings/positions be left as the defaults are?

What do payware scenery makers do? What do expert freeware designers do? What should I do? What kind of maps/radars do ATC have - correct airports or default? I upload my corrected airports from time to time but sofar no more than a couple of thousand have downloaded so confusion is still a risk... :)

Regards,
Tommy
 

scruffyduck

Administrator
Staff member
FSDevConf team
Resource contributor
#6
Priority of loading in FS for multiple copies of an airport is very important. You might find this of interest: https://scruffyduck.screenstepslive.com/s/help_docs/m/20268/l/199760-priority-matters

However this applies to the machine the bgl files are present on. All bets are off in the event of on-line flying of course unless users have the same airport configuration. Moving an airport more than a little will require that approach code is revised. This can be done with ADE and be in the same file as the airport itself. As far as I know ATC should use the final loaded airport but someone better qualified than me will probably know.
 
#7
Tommy, the airport at Barter Island in Alaska (PABA) was recently moved in real life to a new location about 2 miles to the southwest. Using Tools/Move Airport I moved the default PABA to the new location and adjusted the altitude since the new spot was 55 feet higher than the old spot.

Then I used the Approach Mode and changed the two GPS approaches to RNAV approaches as they really are to work with the new airport position. AI Traffic used the new approaches just fine. PABA is considered a non-towered field so ATC wasn't located there, but AI Traffic was using CTAF just fine and announcing take offs and landings to the renumbered 7/25 runway.

When I fly online I disable AI traffic, but online ATC used the real airfield position to vector me to landings there using the actual RNAV procedures. Others landing there were arriving at the old postion on the sand spit next to the Arctic Ocean.

Randy
 
#8
Priority of loading in FS for multipl
e copies of an airport is very important. You might find this of interest: https://scruffyduck.screenstepslive.com/s/help_docs/m/20268/l/199760-priority-matters

However this applies to the machine the bgl files are present on. All bets are off in the event of on-line flying of course unless users have the same airport configuration. Moving an airport more than a little will require that approach code is revised. This can be done with ADE and be in the same file as the airport itself. As far as I know ATC should use the final loaded airport but someone better qualified than me will probably know better.
Thanks Jon.
I am aware of the priority system and the way priorities are handled in scenery manager, and that navaids and other necesseties have to be be handled, i.e. in ADE, if headings, locations or frequencies are changed. What I have difficulty to decide is if I should place/move my new/updated airport from the default to real life (and then offer it as freeware perhaps) or if I should refrain from repositioning for online purposes. I never fly off line and don't use AI at all.

What do payware/freeware designers do when it comes to real life positioning?

Tommy
 

scruffyduck

Administrator
Staff member
FSDevConf team
Resource contributor
#9
I understand. However I can't answer for developers of airports as to how they handle it.