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FSX Crash Problem

Discussion in 'Airport Design Editor' started by dmeikle, 9/5/08.

  1. dmeikle

    dmeikle

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    Hi all,

    Firstly, Thanks to Jon and helpers for an amazing piece of software. Working with ADE has become one of my favorite past-times.

    I have used ADE quite successfully for many small airport projects. I tried to model one particular airport in high detail and for the first time am getting scenery crashes.

    FSX will launch- it can load the stock airport ok, when I try it with my newly created scenery it crashes.

    Error msg: APPCrash, ntdll.dll 6.0.6000.16386

    I'm figuring I probably put too much 'stuff' in my ADE file. Any tips on how to figure out what is too much? Anyone else have errors like this?

    Thanks,

    Drew
  2. glottis

    glottis

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    Hi Drew
    which airport is giving this problem
    and what would you describe as to much scenery
    and is this a modified ADE stock airport that you think you have added "too much" too
    I have never found a problem by adding several buildings,vehicles and static stuff
    to make a stock airport twice the size
    Jon will be along later to comment on this error as it will be night time in his time zone now

    Ray

    edit: can i take it you are using ADE v1.26?
    Last edited: 9/5/08
  3. scruffyduck

    scruffyduck Administrator Staff Member FSDevConf team Resource contributor

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    I have never seen this error before. There is no hard limit for ADE - some very complex airports have been created using it.

    ntdll.dll is a core element for windows operating systems and has nothing directly to do with FSX or ADE. Here is a link that talks about the error

    http://pcsupport.about.com/od/fixtheproblem/a/ntdlldll.htm

    A search on Google threw up a lot of hits.

    Perhaps you could attach or email the ade file so that we can test it also?
  4. dmeikle

    dmeikle

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    Thanks for the quick reply :)

    Thanks for taking a look at the file. It is a bit convoluted because of the nature of the airport. It is based on the stock KCVO.

    I tried to put in a clay textured runway extension that is almost completely "blastpad" to match the Google earth image and I figured that might be the problem- deleting that section didn't help. I took out the buildings farther away from the airport thinking in might be a distance from runway issue- that didn't help. Finally, I tried deleting fences and most of the extra roads... actually maybe it's the layered aprons under the runways- but I didn't know another way to replicate the textures. KVCO is an old bomber base from WWII and has a lot of different types of pavement surfaces. This is very much a work in progress.

    I will look at the site that Jon referred concerning the crash. I did attempt to reload the stock airport- and it worked fine as do all of the other ADE creations I have made. So, I did something wrong.

    Drew

    Attached Files:

  5. glottis

    glottis

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    Hi Drew
    I loaded your file into ADE
    i compiled it (the bgl file is attached that I compiled)
    fired up FSX and it loaded without any problem
    the only thing i see is trees and houses on the end of 9/27
    as you have moved the boundary fence this is to be expected
    so more work is required to remove these and other area parts
    but it loaded without crashing FSX, try my BGL and see if you get the same problem
    the snake path on one of the aprons does that represent a go-cart track? as that showed ok

    Ray
    Last edited: 9/12/08
  6. scruffyduck

    scruffyduck Administrator Staff Member FSDevConf team Resource contributor

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    I just repeated Ray's experiment here with the same result. The modified compiled airport loads fine.
  7. dmeikle

    dmeikle

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    Thanks for checking it

    Hi Ray and Jon,

    I tracked down some of the system problems I have been having. I reigned in an overzealous AVG 8.0 and updated the display driver as Jon's Nttdll site suggested - still crashes upon scenery load however using both my and Ray's file. Thanks for both your efforts. AT least now I know it is a local computer problem.

    Ray you asked about the go-cart track- from Google Earth it appears to be a police driving course. My wife is from Corvallis so I took some pictures of the local signage and the main hanger when I was there last Christmas. These have been modeled using FSDS and I will place them in another .BGL once I can get my computer issuses fixed.

    Is there some way to use ADE to place our custom scenery instead of using another scenery placement program- or would this even be desirable?

    Drew



    Drew
    Last edited: 10/5/08
  8. scruffyduck

    scruffyduck Administrator Staff Member FSDevConf team Resource contributor

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    Hopefully you will be aable to find a solution shortly

    Not in the current release but it will be in the next :)
  9. dmeikle

    dmeikle

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    Graphic Card thoughts?

    I tried loading a flight from the nearby airport of Eugene Oregon and flew North toward my scenery- the crash happened again just as I entered the area where the KCVO ADE.BGL was loading. The thought occured to me that the it may be a graphics card problem. I have updated all of the hardware drivers including the graphics card and am currently using a NVIDIA 8600 GT. Do you think that it might be a rendering problem?

    I don't know whether to try replacing the card or waiting for the replacement of my whole desktop system (the earliest timeframe would be in a number of months).

    Looking forward to the new features of the next ADE- the current one keeps me quite busy and happy as is:) Thanks again Jon.

    Drew
  10. scruffyduck

    scruffyduck Administrator Staff Member FSDevConf team Resource contributor

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    Hi Drew

    The problem is that each system is unique. 99% of the time things work but now and again something turns up that we can't replicate or understand. Sometimes we get a solution in time (like the problem with screen dpi and buttons) other times there just does not seem to be a solution. There are known areas of FS where crashes can occur -I seem to recall areas where there is a change of season (spring to summer for example) and this can cause a CTD. However I'm not sure why this would affect your airport - perhaps you could try changing season and see if that has any effect?
  11. JEL

    JEL

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    I also experienced some crashes after updating windowsXP to service-pack 3 (a few weeks ago) that I didn't have before the update.

    All crashes were related to bgl-files created in ADE, and stopped happening when I removed these bgl-files.

    I'm pretty sure the windows-update updated some system files that now make FSX load scenery in a different way. I don't know exactly what was changed though, and so I still have the problem.

    My personal testing seems to suggest it only relates to bgl-files where the airport creates a new menu in the selection-box inside FSX, but I'm not completely sure about that though.

    BGL files that just hold information like navaids or ils or runways etc still work ok in FSX. But as soon as I change the airport name or id or country from the ones the stock airport uses it crashes whenever it is loaded in FSX.
    So there are no problems updating existing airports if I just leave their name and id and so on unchanged.

    I dont know if this is any help to the thread-poster, but I think it may be a similar problem to his.
    It all started after the recent windowsXP patch-update to SP3.

    JEL
  12. Golf-HotelDelta

    Golf-HotelDelta

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    Hi JEL,

    You will have problems if you change either the airport name or ICAO of a default airport.

    I don't think this has anything to do with XP/SP3.

    George
  13. jvile

    jvile

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    Like George says, changing a stock airport Id, Name, etc. will casues FS9/FSX to see 2 airports at the same location. This causes both the Stock APX bgl and the new ADE bgl to load x2. These 2 airports now have all duplicated data including Start Locations on each end of a runway. It is the start locations that in some cases causes the CTD.

    The CTD can occur at anytime and anywhere within the 108 NM radius of the airport. MS does not allow any Airport Headers to have a different name then what is in the actual MS APX bgl.

    If you have to change a airport's ID (Header data) you must delete the entire stock airport with ADE and start over with a new name and new airport. However this does not work completely if any type approach code exist for any runway and the original Airport name will always still exist in the Go To menu because the ARP still exist.

    You can move the MS stock ARP with XML but only so far (about 35NM's). Moving it too far and MS will force it back to the original location.
  14. JEL

    JEL

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    You learn something new every day :)

    I've just spent an hour doing some fault-finding and it's actually quite puzzling to me what happens.

    It turns out that the CTD only comes when I load the flight in a certain way, even though the scenery is left unchanged.

    If I load, via the free-flight menu, the Maule Orion civil air patrol up on the active runway of X68, with no weather specified and time set to 5 am, I get a CTD every time (even though I turn off all extra scenery and just go by the FSX stock-airport)

    However, if I load the same situation using the same settings except using a different aircraft it all loads up fine.

    And here's the puzzling part; if I then go via the aircraft-selection menu and choose the Maule Orion civil air patrol then it loads fine.

    So apparently the CTD is not related to the scenery (neither my own nor the FSX default), or the Maule aircraft, but to something internal in FSX when the situation is loaded in a specific way.

    I'm not sure what is happening, but I know the trouble began after xp/SP3 was installed, so I guess it may be something memory related (maybe windows now handles memory (or the swap-file) a bit different and some strange conflict arise from the things being loaded in a specific sequence or something?)

    Anyway, the CTD only happens when I load the situation as mentioned, and doesnt happen if I choose the maule afterwards. Go figure :)

    Thanks for clearing out the fact that ID-changes causes 2 airports to be loaded, I wasn't aware of that. This doesnt have any impact on this particular CTD though, but atleast I now only have 1 entry in the selection-menu, so atleast thats not going to cause any unforseen problems.

    EDIT: I just did some new findings. It turns out the CTD is not specific to the Maule aircraft being selected in the free-flight menu, but to any aircraft with a 3-D model. Whenever I load a situation using an aircraft with no 3-D model there are no CTD's. But if I load using an aircraft with a 3-D model it CTD's. Could this maybe relate to the FSX/SP2 instead then? I am a bit bewildered about this I must say :)

    EDIT #2: Ok, I found the culprit for the CTD's I'm having; it's a simple ram-issue :eek: (too little of it). Ofcourse this is good, cause that means the software is ok.
    Last edited: 11/6/08

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