Hi Arno:
Thanks for the for the tutorial(s) on this important info for FS Developers.
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http://www.fsdeveloper.com/wiki/index.php?title=Align_background_image_in_3D_editor
http://msmvps.com/blogs/arnogerretsen/archive/2011/08/28/coordinate-confusion.aspx
http://msmvps.com/blogs/arnogerretsen/archive/2011/08/29/coordinate-confusion-part-2.aspx
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As a followup of my own on this topic... as discussed here:
http://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/showpost.php?p=239339&postcount=33
http://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/showpost.php?p=243033&postcount=60
http://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/showpost.php?p=236268&postcount=34
...I believe I may have identified the
re-projected format which Sketchup uses when grabbing a 1024 x 1024 tile of imagery and/or terrain as a automatically "
geo-located" background for modeling.
IIUC, the reported format used to display imagery in
Google Earth / Google Maps is Mercator projection / WGS84 datum.
"Geo-located" tiles grabbed via the built-in
File > Geo-location > Add Location GUI import into Sketchup appear to be automatically re-projected to
General Perspective Projection / WGS84 datum as max 1024 x 1024 background images.
BTW: These links further discuss the projection and datum standards used by Google Earth / Google Maps and Sketchup:
http://www.google.com/support/forum/p/sketchup/thread?tid=2f278661999ef357&hl=en
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Earth#Imagery_and_coordination
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Perspective_Projection
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Map_projection
FYI: The following is an example work-flow of how I generated a "geocentric" background image for modeling in Sketchup
Global Mapper 'Workspace': Main Menu > Tools > "Configuration" > [Projection Tab]
Projection: "
Orthographic"
Datum: "
WGS84"
Planar Units: "
Meters"
...Next I
re-projected a GeoTIFF of USDA NAIP imagery from Geographic (Latitude/Longitude) / WGS84 / Arc Degrees to:
Projection: "
Orthographic"
Datum: "
WGS84"
Planar Units: "
Meters"
...Then I
exported from Global Mapper a GeoTIFF of that re-projected USDA NAIP imagery with these parameter settings:
Main Menu > File > "Export Raster / Image Format" > [GeoTIFF Options Tab]
File Type:
24-bit RGB
Sample Spacing / Scale:
X-axis: "
0.3 Meters" <
this is set automatically, and may vary with image size>
Y-axis: "
0.3 Meters" <
this is set automatically, and may vary with image size>
Always Generate Square Pixels: {"
Checked"}
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Compression: "
(No Compression)"
Default (LZW Compression)
<
See:
http://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/blend-water-masks.435509/#post-726137 >
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[
Gridding Tab]
Grid Layout:
No Grid (Just One Export File)
[
Export Bounds Tab]
All Loaded Data: {"
Ticked"}
Global Mapper Overlay Control Center Metadata / Calculations
NUM COLUMNS=
2226 <-- (X-axis Lon Pixel span; may vary with image size)
PIXEL WIDTH=
0.3 meters <-- (May vary with image size / projection etc.)
2226 * 0.3 meters = 667.8 meters <-- (X-axis span; may vary with image size / projection etc.)
NUM ROWS=
2096 <-- (Y-axis LAT Pixel span; may vary with image size)
PIXEL HEIGHT=
0.3 meters <-- (May vary with image size / projection etc.)
2096 * 0.3 meters = 628.8 meters <-- (Y-axis "Height" span; may vary with image size / projection etc.)
NOTE: These dimensions:
667.8 meters x 628.8 meters (derived from 'my' particular example image size via a available Global Mapper workspace data set and desktop area dimensions) ...will be drawn as a rectangle onto the 'ground' in Sketchup.
When the above GeoTIFF is imported into Sketchup as a "Image", and 'pinned' to the bottom left corner of that rectangle, the rectangle edges will be used as a guide for precise "sizing" as a background for drawing etc.
The top right corner of the imported and 'pinned' GeoTIFF image will be dragged and scaled until it "snaps to" the endpoint at the top right corner of the rectangle.
But
first one must
Set Windows Desktop Display properties to at least 1600 x 1200;
this allows the Sketchup workspace pixel array to accommodate 2D Graphics at a 'Height' of 1024 pixels; this allows greater legibility of details on-screen while modeling over a background image.
BTW: If Sketchup does a CTD when attempting to import a "larger" background image, see "ADDENDUM in my post immediately below (following this one) :
http://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/showpost.php?p=244941&postcount=64
...Then:
Sketchup "workspace" configuration
- Sketchup Menu > Window > Preferences > [OpenGL Settings] > Use Maximum Texture Size: {"Ticked"}
- Sketchup Menu > Tools > Select ("Select" tool is the 'Arrow' mouse cursor)
- Sketchup Menu > File > New (...NOTE: Select and 'Delete' / 'Erase' default "person object")
- Sketchup Menu > Camera: Parallel Projection
- Sketchup Menu > Camera > Standard Views > Top
Sketchup Work-flow: "Import" a background image for modeling (using 'my' example image file format and pixel size etc.)
1.)
Sketchup Menu > Draw > Rectangle ("Pencil with Rectangle" tool is the mouse cursor)
2.) Hover Pencil-Rectangle cursor over 3D world origin of axes
("Origin" appears over point)
3.)
'Left-Click-Hold' Pencil-Rectangle cursor on point at 3D world origin of axes
.....a.) Drag cursor diagonally towards top-right of Sketchup workspace
(rectangle appears / re-sizes as cursor is dragged)
.....b.)
Drag cursor to draw a small Rectangle of 'any' size; release mouse button...
then:
..........(1.)
Immediately type without quotes: "
667.8m,628.8m";
press "Enter" (size enters into Sketchup 'VCB' / Measurements box)
NOTE: Rectangle "Face" drawn on '
ground' in Sketchup's workspace is now ready to be 'pinned' with an imported "image"
1.)
Sketchup Menu > Tools > Select ("Select" tool is the 'Arrow' mouse cursor)
2.)
Sketchup Menu > File > Import (browse dialog opens)
.....a.) Below 'Preview' (under grayed-out "Options" button) set
Use As Image: {"
Ticked"}
.....b.) Set Files of Type: "
All Supported Image Types"
.....c.) Select and 'double-click' [
file name] of image file exported as described above
(display pauses while processing import)
3.) Back in main Sketchup workspace, imported image is displayed at "arrow" cursor tip
.....a.)
Left-Click arrow cursor on point at 3D world origin of axes ('Imported' image "Pins" to Rectangle bottom left corner)
.....b.)
Move arrow cursor from that 3D world origin point diagonally towards top-right of Sketchup workspace
(image appears / re-sizes)
.....c.)
Align arrow cursor over Rectangle top-right corner; when "Endpoint" appears, 'click' that point
NOTE:
"Imported" image is now properly 'Pinned' to Rectangle face as a background for drawing in Sketchup !
The example "
Orthographic / WGS84 / Meters" background image 'shape' appears in Sketchup with minimal "projectional distortion", and looks similar to that seen when one Geo-locates a downloaded tile of Google Earth imagery onto the 'ground' as a background image.
FYI: I have yet to test making
ex: a very long RWY to see if there is a mis-alignment of the modeled object end
distant (
ex: 500 Meters) to the Reference Point at the 3D world origin of axes after processed via ModelConverterX.
And I also have yet to test
ex: "
Flat Plane / WGS84 / Meters" to implement background images in Sketchup, as well as making a very long RWY with those settings... to see if there is a mis-alignment of the modeled object end
distant (
ex: 500 Meters) to the Reference Point at the 3D world origin of axes after processed via ModelConverterX.
BTW: AFAIK, Global Mapper 12 does
NOT offer a "
Flat Earth" projection, but does offer "
Gnomonic", "
State Plane Coordinate System", and "
Stereographic" as possible true azimuthal vertical perspective projections to be tested in relation to the information cited above regarding how Google Earth Imagery may be 'projected' when 'imported' into Sketchup.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Earth#Imagery_and_coordination
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However, based on available information thus far reviewed,
IMHO it is still unclear whether there may be additional issues involved with establishing the best choice of a projection to use in Global Mapper for export of imagery that will yield precise results when used as a background image for modeling in Sketchup and GMAX / 3DSMAX:
http://globalmapperforum.com/forums/projection-questions/4612-flat-earth-projection-conversion.html
"
Autodesk 3ds Max Help > Exporting OpenFlight (FLT) Files > Application menu Export [Files of type]=OpenFlight (*.FLT)
Real World Location group
Projection
This drop-down list chooses the cartographic projection of the coordinate system. You can choose from Flat Earth, Trapezoidal, Round Earth, Lambert Conic, UTM, Geocentric, and Geodetic projection methods. Default = Flat Earth."
http://docs.autodesk.com/3DSMAX/13/ENU/Autodesk 3ds Max 2011 Help/index.html?url=./files/WS73099cc142f48755558158a8119d88fb23c-63ed.htm,topicNumber=d0e424801
"
Flat Earth (Cartesian) coordinate transformations can also be made. Set −N and remember that azimuth is clockwise from North (the y axis), NOT the usual Cartesian theta, which is counterclockwise from the x axis. azimuth = 90 - theta.
...and:
"
Flat Earth. Make a Cartesian coordinate transformation in the plane. [Default uses spherical trigonometry.]"
http://gmt.soest.hawaii.edu/gmt/html/man/project.html
"
In order to work well with the existing commercial APIs, many users who create data designed for use within Google Maps will also use this projection. One prime example is OpenStreetMap, whose raster map tiles are all projected into the ‘spherical mercator’ projection."
http://docs.openlayers.org/library/spherical_mercator.html
Thus,
I must respectfully request that we proceed further to more clearly identify what Projection / Datum / Units FS Developers should use with commonly-available GIS software to format aerial imagery for export to a file type they intend to use as a background image for modeling in Sketchup and GMAX / 3DSMAX.
"
Flat Earth" is apparently a
very general categorical description that seems
not to be a named choice in pick lists for GIS apps that I have encountered thus far.
Could we
please define more precisely what is meant by this... using more 'current' or 'mainstream' GIS app terms for
projection types ?
If we model using a background image properly projected with such a "most compatible" projection type, at
what distance in meters from a model's 3D world origin Reference Point can we really expect to achieve predictable
placement results ?
Does this mean we really should
not expect to be able to model larger / longer objects, or multiple object scenes with objects located at various distances from the 3D world origin... thereby making it impractical to model neighborhoods, cites, or other sites from extruded "footprint" data sets etc. ?
I'd hate to have to
manually center every 3D scenery object model, export as *.DAE / *.KML, import to MCX, tweak individually, verify placement via an online map or imagery viewer / create a XML-placement BGL, add to a scenery object library then create that scenery object library BGL!
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I hope others here may also be willing to perform some tests with a comparable work-flow, to see if this process either eliminates or produces any continued / different 'mis-alignment'... when
ex: "
Orthographic / WGS84 / Meters" is used
instead of "
Flat Earth / WGS84 / Meters" to implement background images in Sketchup and GMAX / 3DSMAX.
Hope this helps !
GaryGB