FSX Property Layer on FS2002 gPolys

#1
Hi all,

I just cant cope with using FS2002 properties on 2011!! :)

Still experimenting, but I found (what I think) a good way of giving FSX Material properties on top FS2002 style gPolys simply by a FSX material layer.

Duplicated the FS2002 style runway and set 0.05m above ground. Include an alpha channel to give it approx. 30-40% transparency.

Material setting:

-Default transparent
-No Z-test Alpha (allows shadows to display just fine)
-specular (dark grey color) 50%
-Reflection 40% (environment map)/precipitation checked
-Bump map (texture through nVidia plugin) -- strangely after adding this map the flickering vanished even when set at 0m...!>!> could be that is quite late and my eyes are flickering instead :)

Results below:



Rain effects

 
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#4
Thats impressive - for the flicker issue, would it be possible with the FSX Gamepack to make the runway a hard platform at a few CM about terrain height?

At least then you don't get sinking wheels.
 
#5
I was searching for some info like these.

So is this possible with the FSX gamepack?
Essentially, almost everything is still being done with the FS2002 SDK. Only the layer on top is pure FSX SDK

0.05m (5cm) is still likely to flicker at high zoom levels and altitude, unless you tune it.
Indeed there is some slight flickering at high altitudes but I doubt the users will ever look vertically at the runway from 5,000 feet :D Only then I do see some significant flickering..

Thats impressive - for the flicker issue, would it be possible with the FSX Gamepack to make the runway a hard platform at a few CM about terrain height?

At least then you don't get sinking wheels.
So far, with these material properties I see no sinking at all when the .MDL is placed at 5cm. However, the platform attach would be a good way to go round if sinking wheels become a problem...
 

n4gix

Resource contributor
#6
Use an appropriate LOD for the "FSX Material" layer so it will be hidden above 2 thousand feet or so...
 

arno

Administrator
Staff member
FSDevConf team
Resource contributor
#8
Yes, I would also suggest the LOD. The FSX techniques are only used for the details here and those are not visible from that distance anyway.
 
#9
Duplicated the FS2002 style runway and set 0.05m above ground. Include an alpha channel to give it approx. 30-40% transparency.
Where you say duplicated the FS2002 style runway, you mean only the "detail mask" gmax polygon or the "photoreal ground"?

Can you make something of a graphical explanation for the slow ones like myself? :p
 
#10
Where you say duplicated the FS2002 style runway, you mean only the "detail mask" gmax polygon or the "photoreal ground"?
A graphical presentation/tutorial may follow up, but for now I can try to explain ;)

By duplication, I meant actually duplicate the actual plane that is your runway in gMAX. Of course, you may not even need to duplicate, you could just open your FS2002gMAX file with the FSXgMAX gamepack and then select the runway and lift it up a bit (5-10cm). Then you can delete the standard material that is left over from the FS2002gMAX, and replace with a proper FSX material with all properties you want (e.g. refletion, specular, bump/normal maps etc..). Texturing and positioning are a bit of a challenge still and needs some optimization but this should get you started...:D

hope this helps.
 
#11
Very nice! :)
Good idea with the FSX detail layer. I will try to implement this on my next project.
Or has anyone succeeded with a native FSX custom ground solution?! :confused:

-Jeff
 

arno

Administrator
Staff member
FSDevConf team
Resource contributor
#12
Hi Jeff,

I did some more testing with the FSX only approach, but I am not convinced yet. I still had problems with the display of shadows from objects around the ground polygons on them. Besides that it seems quite hard to get a good LOD structure to prevent flashing at the distance.
 
#13
I think adding the layer has the advantage in that you can get all these FSX properties to show in the underlying polygons without any of them having any FSX material applied.
Adding an empty LOD at some distance eliminates flickering too.
shadows are fine, and no sinking wheels either...
no noticeable FPS drop

there is extra work needed though to:
- decide on the sort of texture and its transparency levels
- to match the mapping to with the underlying object, in case one wants a normal/bump map
- and to blend this layer with the edges of the runway, apron etc, so that you dont get awkward effects..quite a lot of alpha channel work here....
 
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hcornea

Resource contributor
#14
Hi Jeff,

I did some more testing with the FSX only approach, but I am not convinced yet. I still had problems with the display of shadows from objects around the ground polygons on them. Besides that it seems quite hard to get a good LOD structure to prevent flashing at the distance.
Indeed they are hard to tune.

With regard to the shadow ... turn off all Z-testing (contrary to what you might intuitively do)
 

jtanabodee

Resource contributor
#15
Hi,
I got a good result but some properties are not the same. I'll collect these properties and post later.
 
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jtanabodee

Resource contributor
#17
Hi,
I think the set up does not stick to any fixed numbers. You have to try it yourself.

Asphalt and concrete texture can be different tranparency in alpha channel.
The more transparent, the more reflection is needed. But different texture cannot be over each other. It causes flickering.
I still see the wheel sink even I make a platform.
LOD's help with flickering. I don't see it at all.
More precipitation, more reflection will be seen, Nice!
 
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#18
This is the thread that got closest to the FSX solution for precipitation. But it is not a solution. To add rain effect (or specular/bump) on ground you still need a mdl base poly with an offset and meterial settings, causing flickering and issues with landing lights, and other 3D lights.

Solution----< move to P3D
 
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