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FSX Graphical representation of the Airspace (Boundary)

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153
Country
italy
Hello everyonel,
Airspaces represented graphically in the map of FSX have this structure.
Excerpt from the SDK:

BoundaryStart
This element is used to indicate the start of a Boundary volume. This element is not allowed to contain other data and must be terminated with ‘/>’.

<BoundaryStart
lat="41.45240683"
lon="-87.01929230"
minimumAltitudeType = "UNLIMITED"
altitudeMinimum="235.00079346"
maximumAltitudeType = "UNKNOWN"
altitudeMaximum="240.00079346"/>


minimumAltitudeType Default is MSL.
UNKNOWN
AGL
ABOVE_GROUND_LEVEL
MSL
MEAN_SEA_LEVEL
UNLIMITED

altitudeMinimum Minimum altitude in meters.

maximumAltitudeType Default is MSL.
UNKNOWN
AGL
ABOVE_GROUND_LEVEL
MSL
MEAN_SEA_LEVEL
UNLIMITED

altitudeMaximum Maximum altitude in meters.

What I do not understand is that instead of the BGL defautl the "minimumAltitudeType" and "maximumAltitudeType" are quoted in "AGL". While the value is in reality AMSL (ABOVE MEAN SEA LEVEL) only in a few exceptional cases refers to AGL.

For example, if the upper and lower vertical limit in a given CTR is from FL145 to FL245 in the file of BGL Default is indicated as follows:

BoundaryStart
lat="41.45240683"
lon="-87.01929230"
minimumAltitudeType = "AGL" <<<<<-------- :eek:
altitudeMinimum="4419.6M"
maximumAltitudeType = "AGL" <<<<--------- :eek:
altitudeMaximum="7467.6M"/>

While the value is in reality AMSL (ABOVE MEAN SEA LEVEL) only in a few exceptional cases refers to AGL.

Does anyone know the reason why the team FSX used to indicate the altitude of the upper and lower level in AGL? :confused:

This for me now is just a small problem for one a little bigger.
:cool: Thank you for your attention and sorry for my bad English.

Giovanni Miduri
 
Last edited:
So the question is:

Why did Microsoft use AGL in defining boundaries?

I have no idea. How are boundaries defined in the real world?
 
As I said before the lower limit and the upper one is always intended in MSL, unless otherwise specified.

FAA Aeronautical Chart User’s Guide
10th Edition January 2012

"CONTROLLED AIRSPACE
Controlled airspace consists of those areas where some
or all aircraft may be subject to air traffic control, such
as Class A, Class B, Class C, Class D, Class E Surface
(SFC) and Class E Airspace.

Class A Airspace within the United States extends
from 18,000’ up to 60,000’ MSL. While visual charts
do not depict Class A, it is important to note its
existence.

Class B Airspace is shown in abbreviated form on
the World Aeronautical Chart (WAC). The Sectional
Aeronautical Chart (Sectional) and Terminal Area
Chart (TAC) show Class B in greater detail. The
MSL ceiling and floor altitudes of each sector are
shown in solid blue figures with the last two zeros
omitted: 80/35. etc. "


Then indicated a level upper as FL85 AMSL shows us an altitude above mean sea level is this is given as a function of standard 1013.25 hPa isobaric surface (QNE).

While indicating a lower level under the transition layer (space between the altitude of transition TA and the transition level TRL) 2500 ft AMSL this example is given in function of the local QNH.


After saying that I can not explain the choice of ACES Studios. :confused:

I also noticed that I have class A areas are not displayed on the map of FSX, even if present in the bgl file by default.:cool:
 
Hi Folks

For example,
if the upper and lower vertical limit in a given CTR is from FL145 to FL245
in the file of BGL Default is indicated as follows:


BoundaryStart
lat="41.45240683"
lon="-87.01929230"
minimumAltitudeType = "AGL" <<<<<-------- :eek:
altitudeMinimum="4419.6M"
maximumAltitudeType = "AGL" <<<<--------- :eek:
altitudeMaximum="7467.6M"/>

While the value is in reality AMSL (ABOVE MEAN SEA LEVEL) only in a few exceptional cases refers to AGL.

Does anyone know the reason why the team FSX used to indicate the altitude of the upper and lower level in AGL? :confused:
Giovanni -

Until your PM today, (I'll address that seperately),
I'd been deliberately ignoring this thread. :D

My apologies in advance if I've misunderstood your intent.



You say your quoted BoundaryStart data comes from "BGL Default".

Could you please identify which -
- "BGL Default" file you are referring to.
- Which decompiler you'd used to generate your xml.



I launched FSX and checked the default map,
and also a decompilation of its source file bvcf.bgl.

Neither of which appear to contain
any BoundaryStart data originating at those coords, (Porter Co Mun (KVPZ)).

There isn't even a single AGL in the entire file. :D

Just in case,
I'd also checked the AFD,
but it also contains no airspace BoundaryStart info.



So AFAICS
the AGL/issue you've identified isn't FSX / ACES / Microsoft's fault,
but originates elsewhere.

I'm guessing you are using a 3rd party edited/addon bvcf.bgl.

As such you should address your points
to whoever compiled your airspace file.



Possible uses for an AGL based boundary
Just a guess,
possibly a boundary might utilise AGL
if it were for a hazard/exclusion type boundary
around a land based obstacle.
e.g. a high telecoms mast



HTH
ATB
Paul
 
Last edited:
Hi Folks

Giovanni -

Until your PM today, (I'll address that seperately),
I'd been deliberately ignoring this thread. :D

My apologies in advance if I've misunderstood your intent.


You say your quoted BoundaryStart data comes from "BGL Default".

Could you please identify which -
- "BGL Default" file you are referring to.
- Which decompiler you'd used to generate your xml.



I launched FSX and checked the default map,
and also a decompilation of its source file bvcf.bgl.

Neither of which appear to contain
any BoundaryStart data originating at those coords, (Porter Co Mun (KVPZ)).

There isn't even a single AGL in the entire file. :D

Just in case,
I'd also checked the AFD,
but it also contains no airspace BoundaryStart info.

HTH
ATB
Paul

Ciao Paolo,

I confess I was a little bit of time I was looking for the "holy grail" but I could not get on top. Then by chance I found in E: \ Microsoft Games \ Microsoft Flight Simulator X \ Scenery \ World \ Scenery, I tried to disassemble everything with Bgl2Xml of Jon Masterson (many thanks Jon) here are the BNXWorld0 ... 5. bgl.

Boundary BNX = X. Bingo!

BNXWorld0. bgl here are CTR, TMA and CTA.
BNXWorld1. bgl here are the areas Prohibited, Dangerous, Restricted and MOA
BNXWorld2. bgl Here begin the coastlines
BNXWorld3. bgl
BNXWorld4. bgl
BNXWorld5. bgl

I have replaced all CTR, of the FIR Italian. :cool:

In between I worked on this I have a few questions. Now slowly I'll try to summarize them here with you.

One important thing for manipulating these files would be good to build a team and give a specific protocol development so as not to frustrate and chaotic updating this database.

After my first post I discovered your reflection below, :rolleyes:

http://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17505 and you're there come close.

Now we have to recover lost time. :)
 

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The first question. :)

If we update the file BNXWorld0.bgl referred to a particular area when it is then made ​​available to the folks of FSX. I think we need to have two files, one for the default file BNXWorld0 purified in the area to date and the other file only exclusively of the revised and updated.

In this way, with the exchange of files does not run the risk of losing and undoing the work done by others in other areas.

I await proposals and anything else that could be useful to development.

Giovanni
 
Hi Folks

Giovanni -
Cheers, understand now.

I'd forgotten about the BNX's,
it was a long time ago. :D



re: AGL airspaces
Got to thinking after I'd posted previously.

Yes you were correct, they do exist.

But MS were correct to assign them as type AGL.

e.g.
An airport's various airspaces
as IRL, extend to a set height AGL.



Those offshore-related airspaces I'd created
were all additional to those existing in default FS9/X.

Hence I created them as addon bgl files.



Are you creating additional airspaces,
or editing existing airspaces,
or a mix of both ?



If only creating additional airspaces,
recommend compiling them as addon bgls
rather than recompiling into default files.



If editing existing airspaces
you'd be editing default files,
and they affect the entire world.



There's also the matter of your "snapshot-time".
Are you intending creating airspaces -
- To match the default FSX "snapshot-time", (approx 2005) ?
- Or to match the latest available data, (e.g. 2013) ?



Navigraph, (? and others ?), already supply this sort of info.



PS
As you are working on Italian airspaces
have you by any chance created the Padova center airspace(s) ?

I know albybz was looking to create these,
but was struggling to find accurate data sources.



HTH
ATB
Paul
 
Are you creating additional airspaces,
or editing existing airspaces,
or a mix of both ?

Existing airspace have been updated, deleted and added new ones decommissioned.

If only creating additional airspaces, recommend compiling them as addon bgls rather than recompiling into default files. If editing existing airspaces
you'd be editing default files,
and they affect the entire world.

I think to adopt this practice; BNXWorld0 the default purify it of the FIR processing at this time. Add a new file bgl which follows like this: BNX_Name_Fir0.bgl.

So when the file is processed by default in the second half not lost a change to previous years.

:cool:


There's also the matter of your "snapshot-time".
Are you intending creating airspaces -
- To match the default FSX "snapshot-time", (approx 2005) ?
- Or to match the latest available data, (e.g. 2013) ?

Currently I have set to 23/07/2013

Navigraph, (? and others ?), already supply this sort of info.

The National A.I.P. :eek:

PS
As you are working on Italian airspaces
have you by any chance created the Padova center airspace(s) ?

Padova TMA working in progress


I know albybz was looking to create these,
but was struggling to find accurate data sources.

I'm sorry I do not know.


HTH
ATB
Paul[/QUOTE]
 
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