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KPDX for FS9 by Sidney Schwartz

C

Carob

Messages
20
Country
us-california
Hello, all.

It was suggested I post something here in hopes someone might be able to help with an issue seen on multiple systems using the KPDX scenery for FS9 by Sidney Schwartz.
I have contacted Sidney himself but as he no longer uses FS9 he doesn't know what might be going on.

The problem is that on all runways the aircraft, any user aircraft - default or addon, bounce like crazy. Enough to setoff ground prox warning systems, etc. I think it is some kind of elevation issue but don't know for sure. When I check that, in the limited ways I know how, all seems okay but I just don't know.

The hope is someone here who knows a bit more can help out. I can post my files to be looked at if needed but I went and download the original scenery again (located on AVSIM with file portland_kpdx_2010.zip) and used the orig Portland_KPDX_ADE9_PH.BGL file and the problem happens there as well. Remove that, or my parking modified version, so the sim uses the default airport file and the problem goes away.

Any help with this issue is greatly appreciated as the issue is quite severe but I love the scenery and would like to keep using it.

Thank you!
 
G

GaryGB

Messages
7,450
Country
us-illinois
Hello:

I tested the above cited scenery package in FS9:

https://library.avsim.net/search.php?SearchTerm=portland_kpdx_2010.zip&CatID=root&Go=Search


I only encountered (1) 'bump' while taxiing an FS aircraft on all RWYs. :pushpin:


That 'bump' is at / near:

Longitude: -122.577786014228

Latitude: 45.5878584433759


NOTE: That scenery already includes an airport flatten that 'should' not allow the bumping you reported in your OP above:

[Portland KPDX 2010 install path]\Scenery\portland_flatten_LWM2.BGL

All points within the portland_flatten_LWM2.BGL flatten area should be at an assigned elevation of 9.140625 Meters AMSL

[EDITED]

The other LWM BGL vector objects are also at an assigned elevation of 9.140625 Meters AMSL in:

[Portland KPDX 2010 install path]\Scenery\portland_1_KPDX_LWM2.BGL

...and:

[Portland KPDX 2010 install path]\Scenery\portland_1_KPDX_VTPP.BGL



Airport properties and RWYs are at an assigned elevation of 9.144 Meters AMSL in:

[Portland KPDX 2010 install path]\Scenery\Portland_KPDX_ADE9_PH.BGL


NOTE: This matches the default (aka "stock") FS2004 KPDX airport elevation of 9.144 Meters AMSL.

[END_EDIT]


Assuming you are using the KPDX scenery for FS9 by Sidney Schwartz in a FS2004 flight, this suggests that you may have installed a 3rd party custom terrain mesh which loads from a position in the FS2004 Scenery Library GUI as an Area layer with a greater rendering priority than that of the the Area layer for the Portland KPDX 2010 scenery for FS9 itself.


You may wish to initially try putting the KPDX scenery for FS9 by Sidney Schwartz at the top of the FS2004 Scenery Library GUI so that its Area layer is above all other Area layers.

If this does not work for you, please let me know in a reply here in this thread, and we can look at other options. :)

GaryGB
 
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C

Carob

Messages
20
Country
us-california
I verified the flatten file is indeed there and it is. Then moved the scenery from #77 to #1 but there is no change.
 
G

GaryGB

Messages
7,450
Country
us-illinois
Do you have a 3rd party terrain mesh covering that area, or another addon airport loading at KPDX ?

GaryGB
 
C

Carob

Messages
20
Country
us-california
No other PDX sceneries or airport files installed. As for terrain mesh, just the old FSGenesis stuff that I've had forever. I took those files out just to test but it didn't make a difference either. I don't have this issue anywhere else though.
 
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G

GaryGB

Messages
7,450
Country
us-illinois
Have you disabled UTUSA for FS9 and any other addon scenery packages to see if it eliminates the bumping issue ?

GaryGB
 
G

GaryGB

Messages
7,450
Country
us-illinois
Hi again:

Before you try disabling any other addon scenery, we should first examine your own "parking modified version" for KPDX.

If you ZIP up your own airport BGL along with your own ADE project *.AD2, *.ADE3, or *.ADE4 file, and attach it here, perhaps someone can identify the cause of the 'bumping' reported in your OP.

GaryGB
 
C

Carob

Messages
20
Country
us-california
GaryGB said:
Hi again:

Before you try disabling any other addon scenery, we should first examine your own "parking modified version" for KPDX.

If you ZIP up your own airport BGL along with your own ADE project *.AD2, *.ADE3, or *.ADE4 file, and attach it here, perhaps someone can identify the cause of the 'bumping' reported in your OP.

GaryGB
Click to expand...
I can do that, but as noted earlier, I get the same result using the file that's in the AVSIM package mentioned above. When only using the default KPDX, with Sidney's other files loaded, the problem isn't there.
 
G

GaryGB

Messages
7,450
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us-illinois
Since the primary purpose of this forum is to support the learning process required for successful development of addon content by those who aspire to be FS Developers (...and IMHO, not merely to support end users of addons that no longer receive timely support ...or any support at all), I believe this would be an opportunity for you to learn how to resolve this troubleshooting issue by attaching the recommended files. ;-)

GaryGB
 
C

Carob

Messages
20
Country
us-california
And what would those files be? I mentioned in the first post I would be willing to make available whatever might be needed to help figure this out.
 
G

GaryGB

Messages
7,450
Country
us-illinois
Carob said:
https://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/kpdx-for-fs9-by-sidney-schwartz.444483/post-814070

And what would those files be? I mentioned in the first post I would be willing to make available whatever might be needed to help figure this out.
Click to expand...


GaryGB said:
https://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/kpdx-for-fs9-by-sidney-schwartz.444483/post-814066

Hi again:

Before you try disabling any other addon scenery, we should first examine your own "parking modified version" for KPDX.

If you ZIP up your own airport BGL along with your own ADE project *.AD2, *.ADE3, or *.ADE4 file, and attach it here, perhaps someone can identify the cause of the 'bumping' reported in your OP.

GaryGB
Click to expand...
 
C

Carob

Messages
20
Country
us-california
I can do that but perhaps it got missed when I said the problem is still there when using the airport bgl file that comes with the AVSIM download. There is no difference.
 
G

GaryGB

Messages
7,450
Country
us-illinois
Perhaps some other kind and patient soul in this forum may be inclined to troubleshoot this further with you.


Otherwise, I recommend that you take this issue up with the developer of the airport BGL (aka "AFCAD file" in legacy syntax)

Please see:

[Portland KPDX 2010 install path]\Portland International KPDX 2010 readme.txt

"Peter Ham made the excruciatingly detailed AFCAD and placed the zillions of scenery objects. Sidney Schwartz made the stunningly attractive custom scenery objects. This project represents many hours of work on our part, and we hope you enjoy using it as much as we enjoyed making it. This scenery was designed to work in conjunction with Ultimate Terrain. If you do not have Ultimate Terrain, some of the roads will probably be misplaced, but everything else should work OK."


Perhaps you can locate and contact Peter Ham (aka "BushPilot49" at AVSIM) to support the KPDX 2010 airport BGL ? :scratchch

https://library.avsim.net/search.ph...eter+ham&Sort=Added&ScanMode=1&Go=Change+View


Good Luck ! :wave:

GaryGB
 
tgibson

tgibson

Resource contributor
Messages
11,343
Country
us-california
Try putting a copy of the AFCAD file into the FS9/Scenery/World/scenery folder. This helps with some elevation issues.
 
R

Ramjett53

Messages
223
Country
us-idaho
I have been trying to help "Carob" with this issue and it was I who suggested he post here. I have the same KPDX 2010 addon scenery installed in my FS2004 and saw the same issue he described, but perhaps he did not describe it well.

By "bouncing" he does not mean the aircraft wheels are leaving the surface of the taxiways, runways, or aprons. It is as if the aircraft...any aircraft even default...is taxiing on an "undulating" surface as if on uneven ground. The aircraft does not "bounce" in to the air, you can simply see the struts for any aircraft that simulates strut compression doing just that, continually compressing and decompressing as you taxi along. During my tests the aircraft "body" seemed to stay level and only the bogies and nose wheel moved up and down...but, again, never leaving the surface.

Like Carob, I do not have UTUSA installed nor do I have any other KPDX scenery or terrain mesh installed, just FSceneX which is a textures only modification to give the "world" a more realistic look from the air. I also have some FSGenesis installs, but mine are in the Rocky Mountains and nowhere near the western coast of the USA.

Randy
 
G

GaryGB

Messages
7,450
Country
us-illinois
Hi Randy:

Ok, I do see the "bouncing" of the aircraft suspension and fuselage on RWYs with the default FS2004 Douglas DC-3 as if the aircraft is traveling over an 'undulating' ground surface.

The 'Ground Roll' anomaly is seen (with no wheel Effects of dirt versus other debris) even if one puts a copy of the airport file:

[Portland KPDX 2010 install path]\Scenery\Portland_KPDX_ADE9_PH.BGL

...placed into:

[FS2004 install path]\Scenery\World\Scenery sub-folder.


This scenario differs from that seen when SDK Resample custom photoreal land class overlies an airport surface that would otherwise be smooth / paved, but instead shows a rough Ground Roll surface with dust / debris behind the wheels, by having no Ground Roll Effects of dirt versus other debris behind the aircraft wheels.

But IMHO, there is a need to test a custom local airport surface type modifier in a SCASM BGL ...set to "smooth" the RWYs. :scratchch

Alternatively, a SCASM Area16N format airport flatten may need to be tested to see if a local LWM2 flatten BGL is the cause,


Both those BGLs can be produced utilizing data derived from existing files in the KPDX scenery package via several FS utilities.

I'm traveling tomorrow, but could make the test files by Monday to see if they resolve the apparent Ground Roll anomaly. :)

GaryGB
 
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H

hgschnell

Messages
1,465
Country
germany
Tom wrote some day:
"Bituminous is simulating a runway made from tarred earth. It is very bumpy. You can't change that without changing the surface type "
;)
 
G

GaryGB

Messages
7,450
Country
us-illinois
Good catch by Guenther ! :)

I had forgotten about the unique Ground Roll attributes of a Bitumenous RWY surface as I have not used one in quite a long time (too much developing and not enough flying ...oops, I used the "F"-word again at FSDeveloper) :-D


Indeed, one could first try changing the RWY type from Bitumenous to a 'hardened' type ex: asphalt or concrete.

GaryGB
 
R

Ramjett53

Messages
223
Country
us-idaho
I will try that Gary and Guenther and report back. Thanks for the tip.

Randy

EDIT: I changed the runways and key taxiways in the discussed file from "Bituminous" to "Asphalt" and the "undulation" went away, so good call Guenther. Thank you. The downside is I lost the rich, black color of the Bituminous surface which kind of sets Portland apart from the hum-drum appearance of other airports. But...we can't have it all, can we? I suppose I could take the Bituminous Bitmap and copy it it renaming it to the Asphalt texture bitmap, but that's going to take some thought about whether I want to see all asphalt a rich, black color...

I have passed this info to Carob in an email. Thanks for the help all.

Randy
 
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