FSX Solutions to possible ADE version 1.78 problems

[mmann]

While installing the current production version of ADE 1.78; I have experienced a couple of problems which I have found a solution to (it works for me at least).

1. Problems when loading a stock airport into ADE (this is also a potential problem with version 1.76)
Pay close attention to the Folder used to locate the APXxxxxx.bgl
Sometimes instead of showing the proper FSX folder it shows the ADE installation folder! This can happen even with ADE showing the correct location for FSX during setup.

The solution: try reinstalling; note that unlike previous versions ADE 1.78 has no uninstaller.
Note that this error can happen when installing ADE to the default location or to a custom location.

2. Problems with ground polys using the three textures gp_Signs_(Red, White & Yellow).bmp
When selecting a portion of these textures (a letter for instance) the GP in FSX shows a different selection!
The textures are dated ‎October ‎29, ‎2015 the versions that will work correctly will be dated January ‎29, ‎2017

The solution: copy the newer dated textures from the "Textures_Base_Mipped" folder to the "Textures" folder.
While your at it also copy the files "gp_Signs_Black.bmp", "gp_Transparent.bmp" and "gp_PatternedLines_Backed_40F.bmp" which are missing completely from the "Textures" folder.

 

[gadgets]

Mike, et al, as noted at the top of page 22 of the ADE_GP user manual, ADE (and ADE_GP) is shipped with stock textures, 24-bit and both mipmapped and non-mipmapped versions in folders with names suffixed "_Base". These folders are updated with the most current version whenever ADE is updated on your systems.

The ADE Textures and Textures_Dpy folders are not touched on an update because the installer has no way of knowing whether you are using mipmapped or non-mipmapped textures or if you have modified any stock texture. Also, in the unlikely event a given stock texture does change, the user will need to decide whether to update that texture or leave the original. (Such a fact would likely be noted in the release documentation.)

Thanks for your note. It's a timely reminder that it's up to the user to maintain the Textures and Textures_Dpy folders.

 

[mmann]

Don, my point is that this was with a fresh install of ADE 1.78 on my development computer (which has no internet connection).

The folder structure and the files contained within were what the version 1.78 installer provided; which in this case proved to be erroneous.

 

[gadgets]

While I haven't checked in a long while, I thought the Textures and Textures_Dpy folders in the ADE install were empty. Are you saying they contain obsolete textures? (I presume you installed 1.78 into an empty folder, not over an old version, the latter of which would account for what happened.)

 

[mmann]

I completely uninstalled/deleted my previous version of ADE before installing version 1.78. In hindsight; I should have kept my previous version and just installed 1.78 in its own folder.

The Textures folder was not empty and contained the older versions of the textures; which created problems when I creating a GP that used them.

 

[raymk]

Before putting ADE version 1.78 on my system (it is not 'installed' but put into a folder) I previously had ADE version 1.76 'installed' (through Windows) and this was working as I would have expected.

My 1.78 also seems to be working in exactly the same way - having gone through the version migration as provided by the new ADE program. I still have my version 1.76 files and can still run this version.

 

[scruffyduck]

Generally we definitely advise against uninstalling old version before installing a new one. This lets the user check that everything is working correctly and also allows for the controlled import of user data from the older version to the new.

Don - The 1.78 ADE installation package currently ships with a textures_dpy_base folder which is not empty and a Textures folder which is also not empty. Should they be in a clean install? In a clean installation ADE will generate a Textures_Dpy folder from the base folder.

Using the Import function in the New User Wizard is intended to transfer user information from an older to newer installation. This can cause problems however if the older installation is then uninstalled where paths refer to the older installation. I am aware of this and hope to make an update which is safer.

 

[raymk]

Jon,
when I loaded 1.78 onto my system I ran the New User Wizard - Import function and all seemed to go correctly.
However, yesterday I was inputting a new library file into my 1.78 LOM and had to create thumbnails with MCX. I put these into a temporary folder on my Desktop. Then went back to the LOM to add the new thumbnails. Having added a few I went into Windows explorer to check that they were going. I looked into the Thumbs folder in 1.78 and couldn't find any new thumbnails. On checking I noticed that, in the LOM, my Thumbnails folder setting was still pointing to my 1.76 folders. When I checked in there, I was able to see the new thumbs.
It seems that the Import function didn't change the location of the 1.78 Thumbs folder to the new set up. I know I should have checked this when I loaded the new 1.78 but I sort of assumed that the Wizard would do this. I will try to remember this in future. It is certainly a good thing that I had not deleted my 1.76 installation!

 

[scruffyduck]

I have gradually become aware of the short-comings of the import settings function and it needs revisiting which is why I recommend keeping old versions. The importer brings across file paths from the old installation. The ideal situation is for users to not store data in the installation folders themselves but create a central place - this is what P3D tries to do but I have failed miserably. The importer gives options as to what should be imported

Project Settings Folder is very prone to problems since it contains paths to projects in the old installation and generally those paths refer to the old installation. It seems that the Thumbnail Folder can be a problem too. In face everything in the second block of checkboxes could end up referring back to an old installation.

Section 13.8 of the User Manual does cover the import but does not issue any warnings about what it is doing. It does have some detail on how it deals with Thumbnails from the old version to the new

This link https://scruffyduck.screenstepslive...s-and-data-from-another-ade-installation-1-65 also covers using the Import function

I need to revisit this whole operation

 

[gadgets]

Don - The 1.78 ADE installation package currently ships with a textures_dpy_base folder which is not empty and a Textures folder which is also not empty. Should they be in a clean install? In a clean installation ADE will generate a Textures_Dpy folder from the base folder.

HI Jon. Yes, I would recommend both those folders ship empty.

 

[scruffyduck]

The base folder? or Textures and Textures_dpy?

 

[gadgets]

Testures and Textures_Dpy.

 

[scruffyduck]

OK - thanks Don

 

[raymk]

Jon,

this discussion has got me to thinking how, in future, upgrades are going to be carried out.

In the past, with ADE being 'Windows-installed', i.e. with registry entries, when an update was loaded the Wizard could find a previous installed version and go-and-get the various items that required passing from the old to the new version - albeit not always perfectly but well enough.

With Don's AIFP, which, like the latest ADE, is not a 'Windows-installed' program, updates are just a matter of downloading a zip file and expanding it into the current version where it updates the changed files. Will ADE follow this method of updating?

It strikes me as being much simpler with less to go wrong but, not being a fully-fledged program writer, I could easily be mistaken.

 

[scruffyduck]

Actually Ray that is exactly how the new installer should be used. The problem is that users are still fixed in the old way of needing to install a new version separately. The installation Notes that I attach for interest do explain this but perhaps need to be clearer. Now the new 'installer' can be used to update any versions from 1.75 (I had to start from somewhere) and that will now continue into the future.

While we are on this subject I do worry that if the overwrite goes wrong then a user could be left with a non functioning version. I am thinking about this but I really don't want to go back to complicated installers - the new one is actually just a zip file wrapped in a little program that makes it pretty,

 

[Pyscen]

Jon,

I do like the simpler install that is currently being used. Concerning the overwrite issues, is it possible to have new production versions install in a new folder that sits outside the user's current version? For example: MSFS->Airport Design Editor 175
The following versions being MSFS -> Airport Design Editor 178 then MSFS -> Airport Design Editor 180, etc...

minor update versions: would be the concern where overwrites are occurring. Maybe, a backup folder of files being overwritten would help in this case. For example, the files that are to be overwritten first get back up into a different folder within the ADE folder. After that is done, the new files get placed in the working directory/folder. If the user has problems with the update he/she could copy the files in the backup folder into the working directory/folder. Therefore still having the means of a working ADE.

 

[scruffyduck]

It seems to me that having folders per version takes us back to the method we used to date. The overwrite of files on an update does not overwrite or change any user created or defined files but just any that have changed with the new update. We have in the past just updated changed files but this results in two installers. So the goal is to have one installer which is simple to use and which does not make registry or other changes.

Forcing a backup with the installer takes me back to a more complicated installer setup and deployment. Including a backup function in ADE with the user expected to make their own backup would be relatively simple. The issue then becomes what to backup.

Part of the problem is that ADE has grown from supporting FS9 and FSX to include version 1 thru 4 of P3D and potentially more if LM ever decided to create new versions and indeed FS2020 if it proves that ADE can support it. There are a lot of duplicate files such as thumbnails in ADE - one for each installation. I went that route because versions change things in terms of file structures and backward comparability. There are a few files that are in common across ADE and I have thought about extending that but it would be a big rewrite.

The other thing is that user created files are separated by version of ADE and version of the sim. By default ADE points users to folders inside ADE for their project and so on. Users can place them anywhere but the default seems to be used by most. And here starts trouble where paths are specific to given projects etc.

My inclination is to offer a backup in the next version of ADE that will backup user files. This would be user driven and might be useful to be done regularly. At the moment users can backup project files but I wonder how often they do it. It would be very strongly recommended step before an update so that if things went wrong then the user could create a clean install and restore the files to it. My biggest fear is that someone will make the update into a sub folder of ADE The other thing is that some folks have gone back to earlier versions. We do provide installers for older versions but the user data would not necessarily be restorable to old versions because of changes

I wonder if I am paranoid about this but recently we have had problems with people updating. I really want to get rid of the import function in the New User Wizard because that seems to cause problems especially where users delete the older version too soon

Ho Hum

 

[raymk]

Now that we have got a non-registry-changing install system, when I want to use an Update I will always make a copy of my original install folder say ADE_1-78, rename it to ADE_1-78-OLD and apply the update to the original. If there are problems with the update I can always then copy back the -OLD folder. This allows me to keep on using the on-screen shortcut icon to the ADE exe file.

I am using ADE only for FSX so is it OK to delete the FS9, P32, P33 and P34 folders from my ADE main folder to reduce the number of duplicate files that I am storing? I cannot see any reason why not?

 

[scruffyduck]

You could delete those folders but bear in mind that an update will put them back