• Which the release of FS2020 we see an explosition of activity on the forun and of course we are very happy to see this. But having all questions about FS2020 in one forum becomes a bit messy. So therefore we would like to ask you all to use the following guidelines when posting your questions:

    • Tag FS2020 specific questions with the MSFS2020 tag.
    • Questions about making 3D assets can be posted in the 3D asset design forum. Either post them in the subforum of the modelling tool you use or in the general forum if they are general.
    • Questions about aircraft design can be posted in the Aircraft design forum
    • Questions about airport design can be posted in the FS2020 airport design forum. Once airport development tools have been updated for FS2020 you can post tool speciifc questions in the subforums of those tools as well of course.
    • Questions about terrain design can be posted in the FS2020 terrain design forum.
    • Questions about SimConnect can be posted in the SimConnect forum.

    Any other question that is not specific to an aspect of development or tool can be posted in the General chat forum.

    By following these guidelines we make sure that the forums remain easy to read for everybody and also that the right people can find your post to answer it.

MSFS20 Distorted texture

Messages
37
Country
belgium
Some time ago I posted a thread in the MCX section of this forum about distorted textures.
I was suggested to post about it in Sketchup.

MCXView.png


IngameView.png


Faulty Textures.png



I was also advised to tke a look at Aerilius' Make Unique Texture++.
But before I dive into that, can someone say what it does and how it would help me?


Here are the files if someone wants to take a closer look at what I could be doing wrong:
https://www.mediafire.com/file/lf3a8lenvqc3n5h/Distorted_Textures.zip/file
 
Ive found that same problems a lot with sketchup model inside msfs, i still dont understand what causes it, probably the conversion to the gltf that changes the uv or something.

the easiest fix is indeed using the "Make Unique Texture" tricks, what it did is simply "Bake"/ separate the texture to its own singular image, probably by doing this,the uv that we set in the "Texture>Edit Position" was overriden to the new texture uv which then didnt stretched by the conversion to gltf.

I also use the MCX minimize drawcalls thingy to minimize the drawcalls and textures since using the "make unique texture" is going to save some new textures
 
Thank you for the answer. :)

Do I use the 'unique texture' on everything, only the ones that are faulty or does the plugin decide that on its own?
If I do this for every texture, the file size will increase a lot. On the other hand if I have to handpick it, it will take a lot longer to create models? :)
 
I havent tried the plugins yet (its been quite sometimes since my last MSFS port) what ive done is do it manually in sketchup, and only on the distorted areas (right click>make unique texture) i know it takes longer but its the only way that works so far (not counting the plugins since i havent tried them 😅 )
 
Last edited:
There are a lot of smaller issues going on here, we can try to address them individually. The solution of "make unique texture," won't work here, but I can explain what it does and where it would work.

The first thing you want to do is to remove all textures and examine the model in Sketchup. You will want to insure that the exterior is smoothly composed of all white, or all light blue polygons. These colors define the front and back sides of polygons and each side renders textures differently.

This image shows evidence of polygon reversal.

ingameview-png.66639


It appears you performed an extrude operation on the vents, or windows and pulled a few polygons out from the rest of the exterior and the newly created polygons arbitrarily selected reversed orientations. However, there are geometric irregularities in this image, that are not present in the model shown in the MCX viewport image, it is extremely unlikely that both images represent the same version of the same model.

I'd like to comment on the predominant texture that is visible. Sketchup has the capacity to both photographically project and tile textures, it can do both in the same model, but only the mapping for one type of projection can be compiled into an MSFS model. Photographically projected textures are just what they sound like, it is as if a photograph was placed into a projector and shined onto the model. Tiled textures are also exactly as they sound, it is as if someone took a tile made from the texture and sequentially stacked that image across the face of the model.

Tiled textures are really nifty in Sketchup, one can take a model of a wood house, touch the model with the wood tile texture applicator and voila, realistic looking wood house. If that seems too easy, you may be a master modeller. Photographically applied textures is where, imo, Sketchup shines as a true extension of one's creativity.

Here is an example of a model that I textured in Sketchup using a projected photograph. You are welcome to download and examine this and any of my models using the link in my sig

2c2f3357-09d8-4045-ad88-b240f5df0645


You can see the photograph has been edited to make it easier to project onto the model. Near the tail, reversed versions of the markings have been placed so the model can be displaced horizontally during the projection procedure, in order to place the properly oriented markings on the tail, depending on which side of the model is being textured.

A common side effect of using tiled textures in Sketchup, is that modellers distort their projection and force the creation of a new texture. This is where the "make unique texture" rule comes in and I consider that to be a band aid solution. First off, "pouring" a texture onto a model to be perfectly spaced and laid out, like bricks, is kind of a step saver, it is going to have the potential to lay a lot of brick/tile images with little effort and possibly have some fitting issues. Next you come along with another step saver, "make unique texture" and you've thrown a band aid on the whole fitment issue. I personally try to stay away from the idea of making a model more complex, as a consequence of making it easier to create and try to stick with making a model more complex, if doing so provides a more immersive experience.

One easy rule to remember is to "never move the yellow pin." When aligning a texture in Sketchup, there are three scaling pins, overall scale (red), height scale (blue) and width scale (green). The yellow pin is the skew pin and helps to shape the texture to mimic the effect of contouring over a curved complex surface. The mathematical calculations required to place the skewed version of the texture cannot be stored in the model and if a new texture is not created that will "naturally fall" into the calculated position of skew, from the original texture, then MCX will encounter all that weird skew texture telemetry and simply assign the default version of the same texture to the polygon upon compile.

Another possible way the skewed texture gets assigned, that I have not researched, is when the extrude operation is performed on textured polygons and new skewed polys are created from that process. To address this, you would want to review grouping, locking and isolating procedures, that allow you to edit specific parts of a models geometry without affecting other parts. This would allow you to, for example, increase the depth of the vent/windows, without pulling the skin of the model with them and consequently making the odd chevron shaped extrusions above them.

There are some odd quirks about Sketchup that bear mentioning here. If you texture a locked model, a tiled version of that texture will cover every backside polygon that was previously untextured. I have encountered render issues with polygons that are textured on both sides, so I am very careful and beyond that, there is the simple render issue, of doubling demand by drawing polygons that are not seen. In the first image above, the polygons that appear to have been reversed by the extrude operation are already covered with a contrasting texture. This suggests that the interior of the model, the backsides of the polygons, have had that texture applied to them.

If that is the case, the only way to clear the undesired texture assignments is to open the model in Sketchup, delete that texture from the model, then carefully reintroduce it and apply it only to visible polygons.
 
Ok, that's a lot to go through. :D


It appears you performed an extrude operation on the vents, or windows and pulled a few polygons out from the rest of the exterior and the newly created polygons arbitrarily selected reversed orientations.

Yes, I push/pulled the windows. I haven't had any issue with my models for other games with this. Should I avoid that? Sometimes push/pull indeed shows the grey side of the face, but then I simply reverse the fase to show the white side. I allways thorougly check my model that the white faces are showing.

However, there are geometric irregularities in this image, that are not present in the model shown in the MCX viewport image, it is extremely unlikely that both images represent the same version of the same model.
I can confirm that both images are the exact same model. Except of course that one is .dae and the other .gltf.

One easy rule to remember is to "never move the yellow pin."
This may be where the issue is. I don't move it, but Sketchup does. As I move the blue pin up to make the texture fit vertically, Skethcup sometimes moves the yellow pin very quickly out of sight, extremely distorting the image in the process. I simply move it back to the position it belongs. (and it snaps to that position)

Another possible way the skewed texture gets assigned, that I have not researched, is when the extrude operation is performed on textured polygons and new skewed polys are created from that process.
I always finish my models first, and then start texturing it. Would that still apply?
There are some odd quirks about Sketchup that bear mentioning here. If you texture a locked model, a tiled version of that texture will cover every backside polygon that was previously untextured. I have encountered render issues with polygons that are textured on both sides, so I am very careful and beyond that, there is the simple render issue, of doubling demand by drawing polygons that are not seen. In the first image above, the polygons that appear to have been reversed by the extrude operation are already covered with a contrasting texture. This suggests that the interior of the model, the backsides of the polygons, have had that texture applied to them.
I always make sure that I'm texturing an individual face, not a group. Since the latter often has 'funny' results.

I did notice 1 texture being applied to both the back and front of the face. But this was not the texture affected with my problem.

I now reset all textures to the default white, and will retry again from nothing. I'll update my post here with the result later today.
 
Yes, I push/pulled the windows. I haven't had any issue with my models for other games with this. Should I avoid that? Sometimes push/pull indeed shows the grey side of the face, but then I simply reverse the fase to show the white side. I allways thorougly check my model that the white faces are showing.
Sketchup is very intuitive and I avoid critiquing procedure, with the idea that there are many paths to develop modelling skill. Sketchup has a "group" feature and a "lock" feature that allows users to prevent portions of geometry, from interacting with other portions of geometry. In my experience, an unintended extruded face is not a simple matter, as it's presence has repercussions, but no matter, grouped geometry solves this concern for me.
I can confirm that both images are the exact same model. Except of course that one is .dae and the other .gltf.
OK. I would ask you to look at the image in my post very carefully. Where the chevron shaped sections meet the top of the barrel shaped structure, there is a slight step, as if the chevron sections had been displaced upward by the presence of the windows. This step is not visible in the image recorded in the MCX viewport and it would be very difficult to texture a model in such a way that the step was present, but not visible.
This step is not critical to troubleshooting, the fact that I see it and you do not, is not concerning, but that step helps you to identify the issue.
This may be where the issue is. I don't move it, but Sketchup does. As I move the blue pin up to make the texture fit vertically, Skethcup sometimes moves the yellow pin very quickly out of sight, extremely distorting the image in the process. I simply move it back to the position it belongs. (and it snaps to that position)
OK, this is bad and you'll need to prevent this from happening. I don't know that it is something that you are doing wrong, it may be a glitch of Sketchup, but you will have to prevent that yellow pin from skewing away. I know this is possible, because I've had the same experience. You'll need to "play" with that texture, experiment with placement. Try blowing up the texture with the red pin to move the blue pin, then shrinking it back down. Maybe move it laterally a bit before raising the blue pin, or try widening it a bit with the green pin before stretching it with the blue pin. maybe even go so far as to use a different dimensional ratio, or format for the texture. Since the yellow pin snaps to position, perhaps save that iteration of the texture and try placing that version of the texture onto the model.

Overall, your procedures look sound and there's little to criticise. I believe in the joy of learning and try to not interfere in the process. I would endorse you to more fully explore projected photo style textures and avoid the tiled textures Sketchup offers, but only because that works for me. Here's a model that I tried to utilize tiles texture for, mostly as an experiment and because it is made of large blocks of stone.

mt_diablo_summit_museum-1.jpg

mt_diablo_summit_museum-2.jpg


You can see that the detail of the stair is completely lost from the poor render of the sim. We can only hope FS2020 better presents details, that are defined only by geometry.

 
I gave up after weeks of trying. :P
I'm interested to hear about your fix. You're about to get me back into it. :)
 
Yes, I’m using Sketchup. And What ever you do don’t give up. Don’t ever give up.
You can also learn how to apply textures in Blender and or 3ds max

i use the thrupaint. It’s a Sketchup plugin to apply textures.

before I read your post last night I fixed my issue for one model by removing all textures and making sure there wasn’t any textures on the backside. Unfortunately, the issue returned on two models I exported to msfs.

Regardless, I need to be realistic and understand that Sketchup is not for game design, I’m trying to leave it completely because texturing hasn’t been easy.

Ill tell you what I did to finally get rid of the issue.
Keep in mind that it’s a problem you and I are doing because if you download other Sketchup models from the warehouse and put place it in msfs then you’ll notice it’s going to look great.

also, I’ve notice it’s the same map that gets distorted. In some cases, just another two.
interesting.
 
Oh I didn't give up forever. Definitely coming back to it at some point.
It's just that after weeks of trying many things I decided to wait a bit and see if it was a bug in either MSFS or MCX.

I also wasn't the only one experiencing this issue, though it's rather rare.

I've been using SketchUp to design objects for 3 other games and never had any issues with it.
I can pump out objects in SketchUp rather quickly compared to Blender, so I wasn't very keen on learning that instead. :)
Especially since MCX supports MSFS, it seems that it should be possible.
 
Oh I didn't give up forever. Definitely coming back to it at some point.
It's just that after weeks of trying many things I decided to wait a bit and see if it was a bug in either MSFS or MCX.

I also wasn't the only one experiencing this issue, though it's rather rare.

I've been using SketchUp to design objects for 3 other games and never had any issues with it.
I can pump out objects in SketchUp rather quickly compared to Blender, so I wasn't very keen on learning that instead. :)
Especially since MCX supports MSFS, it seems that it should be possible.
I’m with you. Before I did further research I must admit 3ds max and blender users are having this issue as well.

I’m glad you haven’t completely quit. Everyone motivates me to push forward, including you.
 
you have to knock down those walls and re-do them. Then apply the textures at aspect ratio 1.0 . This was a good test for me and I'll leave the rest to you, I have tons of work to do for myself.

How did I know it was the walls? I exported from Sketchup to DAE format removed the TRIANGULATE options on the export and saw in MCX which faces weren't showing. For reasons unknown, some textures require attention. It's a minimal thing. But I'm assuming is the exporting with the msfs-compiling issue not a MCX. I've done numerous textures and objects for my first airport and I've never seen this.
Screenshot (73).png
Screenshot (75).png
Screenshot 2021-04-23 08.40.59.png
Screenshot 2021-04-23 08.36.13.png
Screenshot 2021-04-23 08.35.47.png
 
By 'knock down the walls', do you mean remove the physical walls and rebuild them or just remove the texture?
And by ratio 1.0, do you mean I shouldn't rescale them, or just not stretch them? (because as far as I remember, I didn't stretch, just rescale)

Thanks for sharing your findings (and probable solution)!
I'll see if I have time over the weekend, else it'll be for some time in May. :)
 
By 'knock down the walls', do you mean remove the physical walls and rebuild them or just remove the texture?
And by ratio 1.0, do you mean I shouldn't rescale them, or just not stretch them? (because as far as I remember, I didn't stretch, just rescale)

Thanks for sharing your findings (and probable solution)!
I'll see if I have time over the weekend, else it'll be for some time in May. :)
Yes, remove the walls and re-do them.
You can scale the maps but I use aspect ratio of 1.0 on Sketchup.
I also removed the top of the tower and just drew a line from one end to the other, filling in a new circle. But that wasn't giving you any issues.
Attached are the modified items.
 

Attachments

So In Sketchup, I thought it was a [face] issue but it was the way the texture was applied. I use Thrupaint. Before I avoided using Thrupaint as much as I necessarily needed to use it. It should be the only tool to apply textures when dealing with MSFS. Utilize Fredo's tools= Thrupaint. This is a small example below.
Screenshot (91).png
Screenshot (93).png
 
Back
Top