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FSXA FSDS Boolean

orb505

orb505

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unitedkingdom
Hi all,

I'm attempting my first ever aircraft. Many years ago I tried GMax for this but found to not as 'straight foward' as FSDS which has tools very uch geared towards aircraft design rather than general modelling (at least to this befuggled mind).

I have my fuse modelled and now wanted to cut out the windows. I have the tool of the boolean modelled from a closed ended tube and in position. I select both objects and make sure the fuse is the current object. I select the boolean operation but it says there is errors on the boolean part and tool. Unfortunately is not helpful enough to say what this error might be!

I did a search on these forums for 'boolean' in an attempt to get some help, nothing which fixed the issue, I've uploaded the project if anyone could download and tell me the errors of my ways: here

Another thing which is worrying to me as a first time modeller is the posts I did find in my search. They seem to be rather negative to FSDS boolean operations and use words like 'if we can avoid using it' and the like. Should I be using it to create windows? Should I know of a different method? Or should I be looking at GMax and forget FSDS altogether?

Thanks

Confused from UK
 
Whoa!

I found an option called Sanitze and after running it the boolean cut worked!

The other questions still stand though, should I be using GMax? What are the problems with FSDS to avoid?

Thanks,

Not quite as confused from UK
 
Even whan dabbling in gmax, I try to avoid boolean operations.

MAny boolean operations - in FSDS especially, but also in gmax - can be avoided with judicous modelling techniques.

Having said that, the pitfalls of using a boolean operation are that (usually) you have to do a mesh cleanup afterwards, since there are a lot of unnecessary vertices/points generated.

On the other hand, the GOOD thing about FSDS booleans is that the original part and "tool" are preserved, so that if the boolean operation doesn't work out correctly, you can always modify and retry.

I always try to avoid tool edges and points coinciding with the part edges and points.

I also try to make the boolean operation the last possible operation on the part - after modelling it as close as possible to the final shape.

gmax is the more powerful modelling tool, and you will find many that will urge you to just drop FSDS altogether. However, there are also many, even some die hard gmaxers, that will state that the modeller is more important than the tool used.
 
Good words from FelixFFDS

Booleans, if not used thoughtfully, can lead to poly bloat. I see so many things in models now being "cut" where some crafty modeling/texturing -could- have reduced the poly counts by 1000s. At the end of the FS9 era users had more performance headroom to accomodate the less-than-efficient modeling coming from the factory (not to mention the absense of LOD models in many beautiful projects, making them especially tough to use in multiplayer environments), but with FSX I think it is more important than ever to make sure the model is tight and isn't wasting a ton of polys on things like gas caps, small air intakes, inspection ports, cockpit air vents, etc. (or the grandaddy of all inefficient FS modeling....the modeled rivet!)

In the FS helicopter world, it is the rotorheads that particularly get me. Some modelers actually -model- every single linkage, bolt, connector, etc. Rotorheads have tons of small parts. Even worse, is that this contraption is usually animated. Great for looking at statically, but when actually trying to enjoy flying...it takes quite a bite out of the performance budget. I guess if a modeler really wants to go for max detail like that, you would think that they would at least replace the rotorhead assembly with a stand-in for when it is spinning. It makes no sense to animate a 5000 poly rotor head.

I guess it really comes down to modeling for the sake of modeling, vs. modeling for efficient performance in the renderer (the sim). I prefer the latter (both as a user and developer). But everyone has their own taste.
 
JordanMoore said:
(or the grandaddy of all inefficient FS modeling....the modeled rivet!)
Click to expand...

Modelled rivets certainly have a place in the final model - as long as the modeller takes a screenshot in the modelling program and uses that to texture the part (and/or use it in the bump map, etc)


I guess it really comes down to modeling for the sake of modeling, vs. modeling for efficient performance in the renderer (the sim). I prefer the latter (both as a user and developer). But everyone has their own taste.
Click to expand...

This is where a good texture artist proves his/her mettle. I've seen beautifully modelled seats, only to find out later that they were just a textured box!

Jordan, I dare say that I share your approach.
 
orb505 said:
thanks guys,

I guess just cutting a few windows is ok then?
Click to expand...

Of course it is.

There are a few practices that I use to "minimize" the "damage" done in a boolean.

#1 - I always practice the boolean on a COPY of the part and tool copied over to an "inactive" model space. There, you do all the operations without "hurting" the main model.

#2 - even when working on a copy of the part, I will also cut away any an all polygons that will NOT be part of the final operation. Again, that will minmize the polygon retriangulation done. When copying the result to the main model whence it came, then I just delete the corresponding polygons in the original part and replace it with the modified (cut) polygons (then yes, go around the "edges" and join the connected points and any minor clean up.

Needless to say - Always keep a copy hand of the un booleaned part!!
 
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