FSX Ground Lights

[TOWSIM]

Hi FX specialists,
I tried the following to create a simple light source with the intention to create a custom runway lighting system later:

• created a runway lamp based on two cylinders in 3DMAX.
• created a vertical aligned hexagon plane in front of the lamp in 3DMAX.
• No LODs were defined for any object.
• assigned an attach point to the hexagon which defines an FX file to be used
• defined effect parameters for DAY=0; NIGHT=1;DUSK=1;DAWN=1;
• placed the lamp as lamp row into the scenery

result:

• Lamps are visible as objects.
• effects are not visible at all (day, night ,dusk, dawn).

If I leave the effect parameters field empty then the effects are visible during day. I even tested different combinations of effect parameters with unpredictable results. There was no logical system recognizable and even no explanation available how to combine the effect parameters.

Another attempt was to place the effect with an XML file. This caused additional problems. I got the same inexplicable results for DAY,NIGHT, DUSK and DAWN. Furthermore I experienced distance problems. when I crossed a certain distance towards the effect location or reached a specific view angle, it disappeared. The curious thing is, that all the effects disappear even if another location is outside of the distance circle.
Now I am running out of ideas and need help. The attached pictures show my definition in 3DMAX and the scenery result with the seldom case, that the effects are visible.

Regards
Mike

 

[tknudsen]

Why do you not want them to light up during the day?

 

[jdberg]

Hi Mike,

it is an old bug since several FS-versions. You have to place two effects.
One for Dusk=1 and Dawn=1
A second one for Night=1 and Day=0

This works fine for me

Jörg

 

[TOWSIM]

Hi Jörg,
If I understand right, I have to use the XML placement method? That would mean a definition like this?:

<SceneryObject lat="47.866700167" lon="10.617285373" alt="1.0" pitch="0" bank="0" heading="200.8" altitudeIsAgl="TRUE" imageComplexity="DENSE">
<Effect effectName="fx_GNDwhite_light" effectParams="DUSK=1; DAWN=1; " />
</SceneryObject>

and a second at the same location:

<SceneryObject lat="47.866700167" lon="10.617285373" alt="1.0" pitch="0" bank="0" heading="200.8" altitudeIsAgl="TRUE" imageComplexity="DENSE">
<Effect effectName="fx_GNDwhite_light" effectParams="NIGHT=1; DAY=0; " />
</SceneryObject>

As far as I know, I can have only one attach point per object. So the attach point method would not be usable.

To tknudsen:
I have worked in the control tower at that location. We used to have the lights switched on only in IMC and during ATC night. The current solution has only two reliable conditions: Day -> on, night -> off. That is unfortunately not that what I want. So if someone knows how to bind the effect to ceiling and visibility, it would be great.

Thanks for taking part at my problem
Mike

 

[Tejal Bernardo]

Take a look here if could be of help http://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/showthread.php?t=169635&highlight=effects+parameters

 

[jdberg]

The current solution has only two reliable conditions: Day -> on, night -> off. That is unfortunately not that what I want. So if someone knows how to bind the effect to ceiling and visibility, it would be great.

Hi Mike,
if you want to tweak the code, so that you control the visibillity conditions on ceiling etc. you have to use the old FS2004-Code and use MDL Tweaker hiere on fsdeveloper to add the condition.

Jörg

 

[TOWSIM]

Hi Jörg,
I made a little progress by examining the thread advised by Bernado (thanks). I can control now the situation and have most of the lights switched on during NIGHT, DUSK and DAWN. But I have to accept, that the FX logic follows some undocumented rules. One problem is still the distance issue. If I am on the runway and the first runway light is at 90 degrees abeam of my position , then the entire runway edge lights are switched off. It seems, that FSX handles object instances as entire group. Because a runway edge light is a single object, placed at different locations along the runway. Other segments of the approach lights are switched off, if I come closer than 50m in approach direction. Even a vertical angular limit was observed. Some segments of the approach lights are only visible from the rear. Ceiling and visibility do not have the priority for the moment. I would be happy if the simple things would work.
I am convinced, that there is a simple solution because ADE deals with special designed lighting systems even for FSX. The ADE lights are normally fine. But my aerodrome does not have a standard lighting system. It is a derivative because of infrastructure and available space. If I use ADE lighting then the approach lights begin over the city of Kaufbeuren. In another thread I saw( with tears in my eyes) the perfect approach lights created by jtanabodee. That is what I would like to have. The information to use the old FS2004 code will be my next exercise. BTW, if someone knows any tutorial covering my problem I would be grateful.
Regards
Mike

 

[José Bourgoignie]

Hi,

Interesting thread... however could someone give more guidance how to proceed exactly ?

it is an old bug since several FS-versions. You have to place two effects.
One for Dusk=1 and Dawn=1
A second one for Night=1 and Day=0

This works fine for me

Jörg

That's what I mean... rather obsure for me. An elaborated tutorial is needed so bad. How looks the .xml file with those two effects ? And what to do in GMAX ? Two trangles and for each the same effect addad with the Attach Toool (fx_landing) but with other parameters for DAY and NIGHT ? Meant for scenery in FSX.

Thanks. José.

 

[hcornea]

If you are using an fx attachpoint, make a copy of the attachpoint polygon before applying the attach.

Place Dawn and Dusk conditions on one attachpoint

On the other use the Night and Day conditions.

The process need be no more elaborate than that!

 

[Tejal Bernardo]

Hi,

Interesting thread... however could someone give more guidance how to proceed exactly ?



How looks the .xml file with those two effects ?
Thanks. José.

Look at the link ,there is a xml file with those parameters, about the need to make two polygons don't look very frame rate saver

 

[José Bourgoignie]

Hi,


@ Bernardo: ... about the need to make two polygons don't look very frame rate saver.

And there is no other way ?

Greetz. José.

 

[TOWSIM]

Hi hcornea,
the other guys advised me already to do that. The daytime is not the problem anymore. It is a position problem. Some parts of the approach lights are only visible from the rear. Groups of lamps switch off when I pass the first object of a group. The effect is, I can see the runway edge lights during the approach. They switch off completely when I pass the first lamp after touchdown. It seems, that there is something else involved.

thanks for answering
mike

 

[jdberg]

Hi Mike,
probably gianni had a similar problem with the visibility. Perhaps the hint of Alain can also help you:
http://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17136&highlight=visibility+fsx+objects

Jörg

 

[Tejal Bernardo]

If they are Fx effect lights, maybe should be edited ? just guessing.
About the two polygon, I'll try with just one polygon, why I can't attach two effect in the same place.

 

[TOWSIM]

Hi Guys,
I found the reason by surprise. My test scenario started with day light conditions. I then switched manually to night time. This causes obviously a confusion to the FSX render engine. If I start a night time scenario then all lighting objects work as expected. No position or orientation problem. The attachment shows my results so far.
What I have learned:

• I have to create two attach planes per light object. One for night and day, one for dusk and dawn. I don't no why, but it seems to be a MS law.
• The result of the attach point script in 3DSMAX creates sometimes rubbish. It should always be controlled in the 'Object Properties' dialog under 'User defined'.
• A value for 'Offset from geometry' in the attach point tool seems not to be connected. If used, it does not causes any change in the scenery and no XML entry was found in the 'Object Properties' dialog under 'User defined'.
• In 99% of all cases, the bug is found between the earphones.

Now I will start to tweak the FX file to get the results I want to see.

Thanks for all your help
Mike

 

[TOWSIM]

I am sorry for chattering about this topic again. But I found another reason for my positioning problem. During my testing I used always a 3 channel set up made of two additional view windows. The night scenario what I believed to be working was a single channel set up. So the real reason is, that FSX does not correctly handle multi channel set ups in regard to light effects.

Regards
Mike