FSX Instant Scenery 3

[kmanning]

Hi,

I hope I posted this in the correct thread because there's nothing I can find on Instant Scenery 3.

There's been a lot of talk about Instant Scenery 3 and how useful it is. I'm trying out the demon verions to see how well it works and if I can aligned the jetways so that they line up perfectly with the terminal building designed for jetways and not with the glass windows. Of course, the problem is that the demo verions only works within a 50 mile radius of Tacoma Airport. So, I had to use it as a test. Before doing so, I opened ADE and created my own KSEA airport file so that I won't have to use the default stock airport file.
While I was in ADE, I went ahead and deleted the jetway that was already there at gate D12 at KSEA using my new airport file.

Then I opened FSX and went to that location, gate D12 so see if I could actually add the new jetway using Instant Scenery 3. Every time I tried to place or add the jetway and save it to my own airport file, I get that Windows error message that the sim will close and FSX just crashes. It does that every time I try to add the object to my own airport file. But when I add it to the default stock airport file, it works just fine and I do not get the error message. What is the problem about adding and saving the file to my own airport file? I'm using my own airport file because I made many corrections to the stock airport file that was not correct. Does this mean I cannot use Instant Scenery 3 on airport files that I've created?

Ken.

 

[=rk=]

Hi,

I hope I posted this in the correct thread because there's nothing I can find on Instant Scenery 3.

Instant Scenery isn't published here. It is published by Flight1 Software and it's developer is FSDiscoverer, he does not provide his real name.
This is the support forum:
http://www.simforums.com/forums/scenery-and-mission-making-tools_forum31.html

 

[kmanning]

Instant Scenery isn't published here. It is published by Flight1 Software and it's developer is FSDiscoverer, he does not provide his real name.
This is the support forum:
http://www.simforums.com/forums/scenery-and-mission-making-tools_forum31.html

Hi,
I didn't think so but I figured that someone here might know about IS3. I've posted my question at simforums but have not heard a thing from them. I don't know if this is true but I've heard that the developers are no longer releasing any more updates and not providing any support. If that is going to be their attitude, and not provide me support, and expect me to pay an outrageous $30.00 for a product I can't use nor get any support on, I say the hell with them and I will not buy Instant Scenery, if they won't provide me with support. I'm not going to buy or pay for something that I can't get support on, and it seems like every time I turn around, developers are just making products to put out on the market and turn around and just leave them and not continue to provide support, and there should be a lawsuit filed against these people. If they think that using the phrase "trying out the demo should help one to decide rather the product works for them or not," that is not going to cut it.

Ken.

 

[=rk=]

Instant Scenery for P3Dv4 is planned and I am working on it.

I cannot promise a fixed release date yet, sorry.

http://www.simforums.com/forums/whats-up-with-is-3-for-p3dv4_topic58516.html

Not sure why you'd need an update however, the FSX version has been stable for years and has gradually acquired new features since it's release.

 

[kmanning]

http://www.simforums.com/forums/whats-up-with-is-3-for-p3dv4_topic58516.html

Not sure why you'd need an update however, the FSX version has been stable for years and has gradually acquired new features since it's release.

Hi rk,

Well, it's not the update that I was concerned about. It's the support, but you're correct that I don't need an update as 3.07 is stable for FSX. I was just saying that I've heard they're not releasing any more updates for their product and they're no longer providing any support. I don't know how true that is but if it is true, it would show a lack of due diligence., and I wondered if that was why I never heard from them. If they will not give me the support I need, I will not buy their product unless they do their due diligence. I want to buy IS3 because I hear that it makes placing objects a lot easier but for me, it's difficult to use. It seems to make things easier when working inside the sim placing objects but the tools are difficult to use because the manual does not make clear on how to use them, and many times uses the wrong choice of words or phrases.

Ken.

 

[GaryGB]

Hi Ken:

No need to be concerned about hearsay with regard to whether- and when- updates may- or may not- be released for products "published" by Flight1 ...which are developed by author Konstantin Kukushkin.


FYI: Konstantin (who has been involved with FS since AFAIK earlier than FS5) previously "published" and retailed his products via Abacus, and there had developed a pioneering "live-in-FS-preview" DLL module technology for EZ-Scenery.

He subsequently developed Instant Scenery from the technology used for EZ-Scenery and began to "publish" and retail his products via Flight1.


I happen to have become familiar with folks at both Abacus and Flight1, as well as with Konstantin over the years, and it is my understanding that all those good folks continue to maintain an active interest in development / publishing / retail of their product lines.

However, we may now sometimes experience longer intervals in between product updates due to the substantial work required to accommodate the multiple versions of FS available in the marketplace, and P3D with its multiple interim updates has proven particularly problematic for developers to keep up with due to code changes those updates involve.

We've come a long way from initial apprehension over the future availability of any kind of development for FS since the closure of MS' ACES Game Studio in 2010 !


The proprietary SDK BGLComp-compatible compiler used by Instant Scenery (and some of its internal features that read and write directly into scenery library object placement BGLs) require(s) that such BGLs be "placement-only" code for scenery library object placement using only certain types of objects that can be placed via BGLComp-type XML code.

By default, ADE allows one to use the option of storing code in a BGLComp-compiled BGL for placement and run time rendering of entire airports with a mix of objects far beyond just scenery library objects.

So, to use ADE for output of a BGL containing only code for placement of such scenery library objects, one must request that ADE split object placement from the remainder of airport object-specific objects, so that 2 or more BGL types are created when one compiles a project.

Then the BGL containing only placement of such scenery library objects can be "Opened" by Instant Scenery and used to Place / Move / Copy / Delete normally ...without error messages or crashes.


Explore all output options within ADE if you want to be able to compile a BGL that can be used with Instant Scenery.


And regardless, one can also easily de-compile such BGLs and get at any such object placement code and retrieve any needed portions and make any necessary edits, then re-compile for use by either ADE or Instant Scenery.


If you need further help with the IS3 Demo, or a problematic ADE BGL, just ask here again.

GaryGB

 

[kmanning]

The proprietary SDK BGLComp-compatible compiler used by Instant Scenery and some of its internal features that read and write directly into scenery library object placement BGLs require that such BGLs be "placement-only" code for scenery library object placement using only certain types of objects that can be placed via BGLComp-type XML code.

Hi Gary,
Thanks for clearing all of that up for me. You mentioned some things that I would like to have a better understanding on, but first, let me explain that I think I know why I was getting the error message and FSX crashing. When I clicked on an object, say for example a jetway, it gave me the choice to add to first file shown in that menu, or to add to another different file. What I was doing is browsing to my main airport bgl file. Example: when I clicked the object I want to place and the menu pops up, I choose "Add to Another File. Then I would browse to C:\FSX\Addon Scenery\scenery\KSEA_ADEX_KM.BGL, which is my main airport file, and I kept thinking that I browse to the airport file I want to use to place my object. But apparently, that was the wrong way to do it. So, I browsed to C:\FSX\Addon Scenery\scenery and then click to add the file. This time, I did not get any error messages. So, does this mean that I do not add objects in IS3 to the main airport file?

Now to the things you mentioned:

So, to use ADE for output of a BGL containing only code for placement of such scenery library objects, one must request that ADE split object placement from the remainder of airport object-specific objects, so that 2 or more BGL types are created when one compiles a project.

I'm not sure what you mean. How do I request that ADE split the object placements and why do I need these 2 bgl placements?

Explore all output options within ADE if you want to be able to compile a BGL that can be used with Instant Scenery.

I'm confused about this because I keep thinking that IS3 writes those objects to the ADE airport file, and that was why I selected KSEA_ADEX_KM.BGL after I choosing an object in IS3, but of course, I got the error message and FSX crashed. So, do you mean that I need to go to Options and set it to compile a bgl for IS3, and if so, I don't know how I would do that.


Another thing I want to understand is that how do I know if the BGL is a placement object or something else?


By the way, I found another jetway at the 3D Warehouse that would I'm think about using because it looks more realistic. What I mean is that the jetways used in ADE is just a basic jetway and dose not have the part that actually connects to the building. The problem is that the placement is wrong, way over in Denver, Colorado. I guess that was where the model was created. So, how do I go about using IS3 to load this jetway I've downloaded from the 3D Warehouse so that I can place it?

Ken.

 

[=rk=]

I'm not sure what you mean. How do I request that ADE split the object placements and why do I need these 2 bgl placements?

If you are like me, Ken, too many words can be confusing.

The proprietary SDK BGLComp-compatible compiler used by Instant Scenery and some of its internal features that read and write directly into scenery library object placement BGLs require that such BGLs be "placement-only" code for scenery library object placement using only certain types of objects that can be placed via BGLComp-type XML code.

By default, ADE allows one to use the option of storing code in a BGLComp-compiled BGL for placement and run time rendering of entire airports with a mix of objects far beyond just scenery library objects.

So, to use ADE for output of a BGL containing only code for placement of such scenery library objects, one must request that ADE split object placement from the remainder of airport object-specific objects, so that 2 or more BGL types are created when one compiles a project.

Then the BGL containing only placement of such scenery library objects can be "Opened" by Instant Scenery and used to Place / Move / Copy / Delete normally ...without error messages or crashes.

Ancillary words confuse, illustratively this entire translation is cut and pasted, save characters contained in [brackets]:

Instant Scenery require[s ] placement using only scenery library objects. ADE allows placement with a mix of objects far beyond just scenery library objects. [T]o use ADE for output of a BGL containing code for placement of such scenery library objects, one must request that ADE split object placement, so that 2 BGL types are created when one compiles a project. Then the BGL containing placement of such scenery library objects can be opened by Instant Scenery without error messages.

 

[GaryGB]

http://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/instant-scenery-3.441046/#post-781359

Hi Gary,

Thanks for clearing all of that up for me. You mentioned some things that I would like to have a better understanding on, but first, let me explain that I think I know why I was getting the error message and FSX crashing. When I clicked on an object, say for example a jetway, it gave me the choice to add to first file shown in that menu, or to add to another different file. What I was doing is browsing to my main airport bgl file.

Example: when I clicked the object I want to place and the menu pops up, I choose "Add to Another File. Then I would browse to C:\FSX\Addon Scenery\scenery\KSEA_ADEX_KM.BGL, which is my main airport file, and I kept thinking that I browse to the airport file I want to use to place my object.

But apparently, that was the wrong way to do it. So, I browsed to C:\FSX\Addon Scenery\scenery and then click to add the file. This time, I did not get any error messages.

So, does this mean that I do not add objects in IS3 to the main airport file?

Correct; do NOT add scenery library object placements from IS3 to ANY airport file; create a separate "placement" BGL.

Now to the things you mentioned:

http://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/instant-scenery-3.441046/#post-781263

So, to use ADE for output of a BGL containing only code for placement of such scenery library objects, one must request that ADE split object placement from the remainder of airport object-specific objects, so that 2 or more BGL types are created when one compiles a project.

I'm not sure what you mean. How do I request that ADE split the object placements and why do I need these 2 bgl placements?

I have decided against recommending that you explore the option to attempt using ADE to perform a "Complex Split" during compilation for output of placement code for scenery library objects in BGLs that is distinct from placement code for airport-specific objects output into other BGLs.


I may be mistaken, but IIRC, ADE once featured a means to do this without including 3D MDLs and airport-specific objects ...together with scenery library object placement code.

I do not see the option to do this in current versions of ADE.

Regardless, as you will see below in this posted reply, I shall instead recommend that you NOT mix placement code for scenery library objects in BGLs created by ADE ...when saving placements from Instant Scenery.

If you have a 1-piece airport BGL made by ADE that you personally created that you wish to remove scenery library object placements from in order to put them into a BGL created ONLY by Instant Scenery, I may be able to help you with that.

However, there are benefits to both the 2D placement GUI of ADE and the "live-in-FS-preview-mode" 3D GUI offered by Instant Scenery.

If you prefer seeing thumbnails and/or foot prints for scenery library objects in the ADE work-space, and you only use ADE for such scenery library object placements in the immediate vicinity of an airport, then ADE may prove quite useful for that purpose.

Outside the airport area, however, using Instant Scenery for scenery library object placement may be your best option.

http://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/instant-scenery-3.441046/#post-781263

Explore all output options within ADE if you want to be able to compile a BGL that can be used with Instant Scenery.

I'm confused about this because I keep thinking that IS3 writes those objects to the ADE airport file, and that was why I selected KSEA_ADEX_KM.BGL after I choosing an object in IS3, but of course, I got the error message and FSX crashed. So, do you mean that I need to go to Options and set it to compile a bgl for IS3, and if so, I don't know how I would do that.

By default during the first session when Instant Scenery saves placement code into a BGL, it creates its own 'new' BGL in:

[FS9 or FSX install path]\Addon Scenery\Scenery.


NOTE: This process is explained under "Adding the object to scenery" on Pages 11 and 12 -of- the 39 page Instant Scenery version-3 "ReadMe.PDF" file (User’s Manual) installed with the Demo


The end user is prompted as to whether they wish to save into that BGL with the pre-supplied default file name.

If the user chooses a different folder path and/or file name via "Add to Another File", that different path and/or file name becomes a "most recently used" value submitted the next time the end user saves a scenery library object placement.

At that time, the end user can browse and edit the pre-supplied file name with a different folder path and/or file name (which then becomes a "most recently used" value submitted the next time the end user saves a scenery library object placement).

I suggest that it is a "best practice" to use (1) scenery library object placement BGL for each airport-related project using a name structure somewhat similar to the one that ADE submits for ex: airport projects.

But in this case, one may opt to add a _PLC suffix at the end of the suggested file name, as a clue that the BGL type is 'only' a scenery library object placement BGL that does not contain other types of code or the actual 3D MDLs themselves in a BGLComp-XML-type library format (which would effectively "Geo-lock" placement of those objects ...but that is an entire separate subject unto itself).

Another thing I want to understand is that how do I know if the BGL is a placement object or something else?

Although there are ways to determine via de-compilation whether a *._OBJ BGL created by ADE has only airport-specific 3D objects, or a 'mix' of airport-specific 3D object MDLs and other MDLs for 3D scenery library objects from default or 3rd party sources along with scenery library object placement code, that subject matter may prove complex for some newcomers to learn, and thus may confuse them.

Worse yet, tinkering with that technology may lead some to 're-package' MDL objects into other BGLs with resulting duplication of such objects and/or their GUIDs, with generally undesirable consequences to their FS run time rendering of such objects as well as overall FPS performance ...and potentially also for any others in the FS Community who install such BGLs containing 're-distributed' 3D MDLs.

So, I am just not going to recommend doing that at this time.

I will, however, simply state that is a "best practice" to NOT mix placement code for scenery library objects in BGLs created by ADE ...when saving placements from Instant Scenery

By the way, I found another jetway at the 3D Warehouse that would (work ?) I'm think(ing ?) about using because it looks more realistic. What I mean is that the jetways used in ADE is just a basic jetway and (does) not have the part that actually connects to the building.

The problem is that the placement is wrong, way over in Denver, Colorado. I guess that was where the model was created. So, how do I go about using IS3 to load this jetway I've downloaded from the 3D Warehouse so that I can place it ?

Ken.

First, bear in mind that you may not be permitted to distribute / re-distribute to the public, any original or modified version of a 3D model from the 3D Warehouse ...without written permission of the author.

That said, if this is intended only for use on your own computer, you may opt to download a KMZ version of the 3D model, then edit to remove or change the Geo-location information in Sketchup via:

Sketchup Menu > Window > Model Info > Geo-location.


PS: I see you have started another thread on this topic at the "official" Instant Scenery support forum on the Flight1 SimForums website:

http://www.simforums.com/forums/topic58916_post373545.html#373545


Please remember my reply to your OP here in this thread regarding Instant Scenery 3, and the basis for the history of infrequent replies and support that have thus far been the pattern of the author since Instant Scenery was released.

It will do little good to nag, complain, or threaten to request a refund (or non-purchase); if anything, doing that may influence the developer to question whether he wishes to even continue with development for a stable, reasonably well-documented product geared IMHO, primarily towards more knowledgeable FS Developers ...that he may have (necessarily) moved beyond in order to work on updating other current products and/or developing new products.

Also, bear in mind that historically, there was NO support mechanism at all for EZ-Scenery and any of the authors other products at Abacus aside from a 'community self-help' sub-forum located on a web site for a legacy 3rd party scenery product named "Birds Eye View" (aka "BEV") years ago.

So, I suppose we should be glad that at least a few times per year, we do occasionally have the opportunity to communicate with the author and receive replies.

But you should not expect timely and/or interactive support for that product line by that author.


And on a practical basis, aside from the manual, support is via the "community self-help" mechanism there ...and here at FS Developer.


BTW: I am both curious and concerned that you stated a IS3 context menu option offered a path to "Add to APX151150" and/or IIUC, that path was offered via the "Add to Another File" browse dialog.

All I can say based on what I read is, you should 'thank your lucky stars' that you did not choose the "Add to APX151150" option, which is, as you stated "the default (airport ?) file in FSX" for ICAO KPVD.

My concern is how that even got into the "most recently used" file database of Instant Scenery !


NEVER OPEN OR WRITE INTO A FSX DEFAULT AIRPORT OR OTHER FS DEFAULT SCENERY BGL FILE !!!

GaryGB

 

[=rk=]

Ken, according to the Trimble TOS and the General Model License, you are permitted to download, create derivative versions and distribute models of jetways from the 3d Warehouse.

First, bear in mind that you may not be permitted to distribute / re-distribute to the public, any original or modified version of a 3D model from the 3D Warehouse ...without written permission of the author.

Trimble is quite clear that uploaded models become the property of Trimble and by extension there is no obligation to determine the identity of, locate, or contact an original author:

1. Grant of Licenses. Distributors grant two licenses to their Models as follows:
   To Trimble. For all Models you Distribute on or through 3D Warehouse, you hereby grant to Trimble a nonexclusive, worldwide, perpetual, transferrable (with the right to sublicense through multiple tiers), irrevocable license (under all applicable intellectual property rights) to copy, publicly perform and display, use, distribute, create derivative works of, store, promote, market, support, transmit, and otherwise make available on or through 3D Warehouse each Model and related content, including without limitation as necessary to promote, operate and make available 3D Warehouse and any related Trimble products or services. The foregoing license includes the rights for Trimble to make available Models (or any parts, related content or derivative works thereof) through Trimble’s partners and sublicensees.
   
   To the End User. You will make your Models available to end users pursuant to the General Model License.
   

https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/tos.html

General Model License

Subject to the provisions of this License Agreement (including, but not limited to, the license restrictions set forth below), the Developer grants you a limited, worldwide, royalty-free, non-transferable and non-exclusive license (without the right to sublicense) to download, reproduce, adapt, make derivative works based on, modify, publish, publicly display and perform, distribute, make, sell, offer to sell, import, and use Models for the uses expressly authorized below.

1. 
   The license to the Models granted above is limited to:
   
   1. Creating derivative works of Models (“Creations”), including by substantially modifying geometry, color, or other attributes of the Models, provided that if you upload any Creation to the 3D Warehouse, you will be a Developer under the 3D Warehouse Terms of Use and such Creation shall constitute a “Model” under the Terms of Use;
   2. Incorporating or including Models and Creations into a larger work or a deliverable for a third party (“Combined Work”), provided that the Combined Work includes substantial additional content to the original Model;
   3. Distributing Models, Creations, and Combined Works to third parties for your business purposes (including for commercial purposes);
   4. Making a reasonable number of copies of the Models, Creations, and Combined Works in connection with the above uses; and
   5. Using the Models as Trimble may approve from time to time in its sole discretion.

https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/tos.html#license

 

[kmanning]

Correct; do NOT add scenery library object placements from IS3 to ANY airport file; create a separate "placement" BGL.

I think I got it now. I just had the wrong understanding about how to use it, and to me, the manual was not clear on that, but you explained it so that I better understand it. It come to mind that it was probably something that I'm not doing right. I guess I'm correct to say that ALL of the objects in IS3 are placement objects only.

By default during the first session when Instant Scenery saves placement code into a BGL, it creates its own 'new' BGL in:

[FS9 or FSX install path]\Addon Scenery\Scenery.

Yes, I think that's where it saved my Jetway bgl. But I was thinking that since I'm creating an updated airport for KPVD using ADE for runway and taxiways corrections and, ex, along with the created updated terminal I created in Sketchup, I think it would be better to create a folder for KPVD, and in that folder, add a Scenery and Texture folder, and place the objects in IS3, such as the jetway, in it's own bgl file in the Scenery folder along with the other bgl files. I would think that's where the option to select "Add to Another File" would come in. Do you think this would be more organized if I do it this way? This is the structure I've noted in many of the scenery products I've purchased, and they're organized.

NOTE: This process is explained under "Adding the object to scenery" on Pages 11 and 12 -of- the 39 page Instant Scenery version-3 "ReadMe.PDF" file (User’s Manual) installed with the Demo

Yes, I remember reading over that, so I guess I was on the right pages.

I suggest that it is a "best practice" to use (1) scenery library object placement BGL for each airport-related project using a name structure somewhat similar to the one that ADE submits for ex: airport projects.

Yes, that's what I've been trying to do, to keep them unique.

But in this case, one may opt to add a _PLC suffix at the end of the suggested file name, as a clue that the BGL type is 'only' a scenery library object placement BGL that does not contain other types of code or the actual 3D MDLs themselves in a BGLComp-XML-type library format (which would effectively "Geo-lock" placement of those objects ...but that is an entire separate subject unto itself).

That's sounds like a good idea. I've noticed you say "does not contain a code, or other types of code." If I understand you correctly, these placement files are the files that will NOT open in ADE because they're not the main airport files. But you may be referring to other codes I'm not familiar with.

I will, however, simply state that is a "best practice" to NOT mix placement code for scenery library objects in BGLs created by ADE ...when saving placements from Instant Scenery.

I'm not sure but are you saying that it's not best to mix, say for example, an airport file in ADE along with bgl placement files from IS3 in a Scenery Folder for an airport? Say for example, C:\FSX\Addon Scenery\KPVD\Scenery, and place all the bgl files in this Scenery folder, and keep all my bgl files separately. This is how I see other bgl files structured in FSX. As a matter of fact, that how I organized my KBHM files for the airport I created.

PS: I see you have started another thread on this topic at the "official" Instant Scenery support forum on the Flight1 SimForums website:

http://www.simforums.com/forums/topic58916_post373545.html#373545

Please remember my reply to your OP here in this thread regarding Instant Scenery 3, and the basis for the history of infrequent replies and support that have thus far been the pattern of the author since Instant Scenery was released.

It will do little good to nag, complain, or threaten to request a refund (or non-purchase); if anything, doing that may influence the developer to question whether he wishes to even continue with development for a stable, reasonably well-documented product geared IMHO, primarily towards more knowledgeable FS Developers ...that he may have (necessarily) moved beyond in order to work on updating other current products and/or developing new products.

Also, bear in mind that historically, there was NO support mechanism at all for EZ-Scenery and any of the authors other products at Abacus aside from a 'community self-help' sub-forum located on a web site for a legacy 3rd party scenery product named "Birds Eye View" (aka "BEV") years ago.

So, I suppose we should be glad that at least a few times per year, we do occasionally have the opportunity to communicate with the author and receive replies.

But you should not expect timely and/or interactive support for that product line by that author.

Actually, I did not expect it directly from the author. It could be anyone who's knowlegable in IS3. I wasn't trying to nag but I was concerned over that problem I was having because you've mentioned that IS3 would be a big help for me and I thought so too. Then when I went to find their website that rk posted, I could not find it so I figured they just left everyone and were no longer providing any support. Usually on a product, one can go to their website and there would be FAQs or troubleshooting tips that may explain problems some run into. After running into the error problems, which was actually due to placing the file in the main airport file, I got to thinking that all the great things I've hear about IS3 were not going to work out. But, I'm glad it turn out to be my mistake instead of some code or something in IS3. I thought I wasn't going to be able to use it. I didn't want to spend out the money if I wasn't going to be able to use it or get error messages every time I turn around and not get support. But I know where to come to if I need it. Actually, I think I posted here first, but it was stated that I need to post at flight1, so that's why you see my question posted there too.

And on a practical basis, aside from the manual, support is via the "community self-help" mechanism there ...and here at FS Developer.

I did noticed when I posted here that I did not see anything regarding IS3 so I figured it might be better to post at flight1.

BTW: I am both curious and concerned that you stated a IS3 context menu option offered a path to "Add to APX151150" and/or IIUC, that path was offered via the "Add to Another File" browse dialog.
My concern is how that even got into the "most recently used" file database of Instant Scenery

I'm curious too. I don't know why that path showed up in that first option unless it was something I've done to cause it to do so. I do recall that before running the sim and IS3, which operates in the sim, I did open ADE and browsed to the stock KSEA airport which was APX151150, and purposely deleted the jetway at gate D12, and that of course, created another airport file with my initials, so that I can test placing the jetway object there from IS3. That's the only thing I remember doing.

Okay, now I have one question before I purchase IS3. Will models downloaded from the 3D Warehouse into Sketchup be imported to IS3 so that I can use that object to place into my airport scenery?

Ken.

 

[GaryGB]

http://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/instant-scenery-3.441046/#post-781469

I think I got it now. I just had the wrong understanding about how to use it, and to me, the manual was not clear on that, but you explained it so that I better understand it. It come to mind that it was probably something that I'm not doing right. I guess I'm correct to say that ALL of the objects in IS3 are placement objects only.

Certainly the IS3 manual, like many such specialized payware or freeware FS utilities, would benefit from being further updated with more current and more complete explanations.

I was thinking that since I'm creating an updated airport for KPVD using ADE for runway and taxiways corrects and, ex, along with the created updated terminal I created in Sketchup, I think it would be better to create a folder for KPVD, and in that folder, add a Scenery and Texture folder, and place the objects in IS3, such as the jetway, in it's own bgl file in the Scenery folder along with the other bgl files.

I would think that's where the option to select "Add to Another File" would come in. Do you think this would be more organized if I do it this way?

Yes; IMHO it is always best to keep all custom scenery BGL files for a project together in the same 'active' folder chain.

http://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/instant-scenery-3.441046/#post-781411

But in this case, one may opt to add a _PLC suffix at the end of the suggested file name, as a clue that the BGL type is 'only' a scenery library object placement BGL that does not contain other types of code or the actual 3D MDLs themselves in a BGLComp-XML-type library format (which would effectively "Geo-lock" placement of those objects ...but that is an entire separate subject unto itself).

That's sounds like a good idea. I've noticed you say "does not contain a code, or other types of code." If I understand you correctly, these placement files are the files that will NOT open in ADE because they're not the main airport files. But you may be referring to other codes I'm not familiar with.

Correct; a scenery library object placement BGL does not contain other types of code such as airport facilities data (aka "AFD"), placement of airport-specific objects (ex: windsocks, VOR objects, fuel pumps associated with 'triggers', etc.), or the actual 3D MDLs in a BGLComp-XML-type library format ...that are otherwise only being 'placed' via instructions in the placement BGL.

http://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/instant-scenery-3.441046/#post-781411

Correct; do NOT add scenery library object placements from IS3 to ANY airport file; create a separate "placement" BGL.

I will, however, simply state that is a "best practice" to NOT mix placement code for scenery library objects in BGLs created by ADE ...when saving placements from Instant Scenery

I'm not sure, but are you saying that it's not best to mix, say for example, an airport file in ADE along with bgl placement files from IS3 in a Scenery Folder for an airport?

Say for example, C:\FSX\Addon Scenery\KPVD\Scenery, and place all the bgl files in this Scenery folder, and keep all my bgl files separately. This is how I see other bgl files structured in FSX. As a matter of fact, that how I organized my KBHM files for the airport I created.

No, IMHO it is always best to keep all custom scenery BGL files for a project together in the same 'active' folder chain.

What I'm saying is do not write placement data from Instant Scenery into default or custom BGL files that contain either airports or placement of any objects ...which were output by ADE.

I'm curious too. I don't know why that path showed up in that first option unless it was something I've done to cause it to do so. I do recall that before running the sim and IS3, which operates in the sim, I did open ADE and browsed to the stock KSEA airport which was APX151150, and purposely deleted the jetway at gate D12, and that of course, created another airport file with my initials, so that I can test placing the jetway object there from IS3. That's the only thing I remember doing.

I was afraid you'd say that you had edited the stock KSEA airport in APX151150, and deleted the jetway at gate D12 from that default BGL ...using Instant Scenery.

I suggest that you still check on that, by temporarily disabling your custom airport BGL file made via ADE named with your initials (which may contain a "exclude rectangle" for the jetway you "deleted"), so that you can test whether the jetway at gate D12 is still there with- and without- IS3 running within FSX after launched from the FSX 'Addon' menu.

Let me know what your findings are regarding this potential issue.

Okay, now I have one question before I purchase IS3. Will models downloaded from the 3D Warehouse into Sketchup be imported to IS3 so that I can use that object to place into my airport scenery?

Ken.

The Trimble version of the 3D warehouse is now somewhat different than the Google version (Google transferred / 'sold' PORTIONS of the 3D warehouse to Trimble), but some available 3D models may still need to be simplified in Sketchup to reduce geometry and/or texture complexity before export back to KMZ, and import to MCX.

Also, because only PORTIONS of the original Google 3D warehouse were transferred / 'sold' to Trimble, there 'may' still be some 'inherited' licensing restrictions that may apply to 'some' 3D models; thus, IMHO, each object intended to be used for public distribution by 3rd parties may require further inquiry as to permission for use.

This may be particularly the case with KMZ files of 3D models displayed by Google Earth Desktop in "legacy 3D buildings" mode ...that are thereby "Geo-located":

https://help.sketchup.com/en/tos/3dwh

https://www.google.com/search?sourc...j33i22i29i30k1j33i21k1j33i160k1.0.JK0UcLEANdg


Regardless of whether they are subject to any edits in Sketchup before export to a KMZ file format, when such a 3D model KMZ file is imported into MCX, and after configuration of "Night" (aka "_LM" file name) textures, they can then be exported from MCX ...as FSX Scenery BGLs.

Alternatively, MCX can package the output MDLs into a scenery object library BGL.

Instant Scenery will automatically seek and find any such scenery object library BGLs containing scenery objects located in a Area layer set 'active' in the FSX Scenery Library

GaryGB.

 

[kmanning]

I was afraid you'd say that you had edited the stock KSEA airport in APX151150, and deleted the jetway at gate D12 from that default BGL ...using Instant Scenery.

No, I deleted the jetway in my own airport file in ADE so that I can add a jetway to that same location using IS3. That was the reason I created my own KSEA airport file so that I would not mess up the stock if I wanted to experiment. It seems that I've heard, or read, that if one deletes an object in a stock airport, you cannot bring it back, and it would have to be re-installed.

I suggest that you still check on that, by temporarily disabling your custom airport BGL file made via ADE named with your initials (which may contain a "exclude rectangle" for the jetway you "deleted"), so that you can test whether the jetway at gate D12 is still there with- and without- IS3 running within FSX after launched from the FSX 'Addon' menu.

Let me know what your findings are regarding this potential issue.

Just wanted to let you know that the jetway is still there in the KSEA original stock APX151150. I did remove my created KSEA airport file before loading the sim and I even checked the stock in ADE and the jetway is there.

(which may contain a "exclude rectangle" for the jetway you "deleted")

I just wanted to make clear that when I said I deleted the jetway, I deleted it by using the DELETE Key or right clicking the mouse and selecting delete in ADE. I did not exclude it. I tried to do it that way but I'm not doing something right. I'll cover that in another thread since this one is about IS3.

Regardless of whether they are subject to any edits in Sketchup before export to a KMZ file format, when such a 3D model KMZ file is imported into MCX, and after configuration of "Night" (aka "_LM" file name) textures, they can then be exported from MCX ...as FSX Scenery BGLs.

Instant Scenery will automatically seek and find any such scenery object library BGLs containing scenery objects located in a Area layer set 'active' in the FSX Scenery Library.

So if I understand correctly, I would need to export the model into a bgl file using MCX, and when I launch IS3, it will scan my scenery files in FSX and find that bgl jetway file. Then from that point, I can place it where I need it, correct?

Ken

 

[GaryGB]

http://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/instant-scenery-3.441046/#post-781493

Just wanted to let you know that the jetway is still there in the KSEA original stock APX151150. I did remove my created KSEA airport file before loading the sim and I even checked the stock in ADE and the jetway is there.

Hi Ken:

Glad your default APX151150 BGL is intact.

So if I understand correctly, I would need to export the model into a bgl file using MCX, and when I launch IS3, it will scan my scenery files in FSX and find that bgl jetway file. Then from that point, I can place it where I need it, correct?

Ken

Yes.

But, in MCX, you will also have to:

* configure "Night" LightMap (aka "_LM" file name suffix) textures for the 3D MDL

* convert all textures to Powers of 2, DDS format, over-write original textures in the MDL with the new DDS version

* export the textures to a new paired local \Texture sub-folder under a top-folder name such as ex: KPVD_ADEX_KM

* export the BGL to a new paired local \Scenery sub-folder under a top-folder name such as ex: KPVD_ADEX_KM


Then in FSX you will also have to:

* In FS Scenery Library GUI, add ex: KPVD_ADEX_KM folder chain as a new 'active' Area at top of the stack of Area layers.


When you start FS and launch IS3, it will update its database with all 'active' scenery object libraries.

You should then find your scenery object library BGL available in the IS3 pick-list.


GaryGB

 

[Gman]

Those were some great comments from Gary and Rick.
I might add to Gary's comment on always verifying which .bgl is currently the active (last saved) .bgl when you go to save, that you may want to consider breaking up larger IS3 projects into two or more groups on separate .bgls, especially if you plan to share your work with others whose computers may be less robust than yours.

Instant Scenery tends to be so easy to use, that overkill is easily achieved. So have a .bgl with an overall layer of everything you may want to add, and then add to another .bgl more objects. i.e., a parking lot with ten cars on one .bgl, and add ten more cars (in different positions) to a separate .bgl.
Even with the second .bgl deactivated, the lot has a good representation of cars. Likewise GSE, trees, static aircraft, etc. Since all objects are equally distributed on each .bgl, a user can even swap out the used and unused .bgls occasionally for a different look.

I might add that if you are planning on buying the current version of IS to use with FSX, don't assume you will get a free upgrade to future versions that may be developed to work with newer versions of P3D as they come along should you decide to buy P3D in the future. I had this issue when I went from FSX to FSX-SE, and while newer purchasers were given the upgrade free, those who bought Instant Scenery when it first came out were denied.

Have fun
Gman

 

[kmanning]

Hi,
I'm trying to delete an object using the IS3 and it's not highlighting the object that I placed. I read the manual and pages 13 and 14 gives instructions how to do that. I'm following those instructions and it's not doing what the manual says, that is, highlighting the object that I want to delete. One thing I've noticed in the manual is that where it gives instructions on how to add objects, on page 11 under Adding the Object to the Scenery, in the photo, I noticed that "Add To My Scenery.BGL" is shown after right clicking the mouse. When I add my object, that does not come up. It shows some file name, or something else. So, when I right click to add an object, should it say "Add To My Scenery.BGL"? If it does, it's not say that, and I was wondering if that is the reason I cannot delete the object.

Ken.

 

[GaryGB]

http://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/instant-scenery-3.441046/#post-781830

Hi,

I'm trying to delete an object using the IS3 and it's not highlighting the object that I placed. I read the manual and pages 13 and 14 gives instructions how to do that. I'm following those instructions and it's not doing what the manual says, that is, highlighting the object that I want to delete.

One thing I've noticed in the manual is that where it gives instructions on how to add objects, on page 11 under Adding the Object to the Scenery, in the photo, I noticed that "Add To My Scenery.BGL" is shown after right clicking the mouse. When I add my object, that does not come up. It shows some file name, or something else. So, when I right click to add an object, should it say "Add To My Scenery.BGL"? If it does, it's not say(ing ?) that, and I was wondering if that is the reason I cannot delete the object.

Ken.

Hi Ken:

If you are trying to delete an object placed by a FS / P3D stock airport BGL, or other default scenery library object placement BGL, you should instead use an Exclusion Rectangle.


Launch IS3, Left-click, hold-down, and drag the Mouse button so that the cursor draws a RED bounding box closely surrounding the scenery library object you want to "exclude" from display.

When the RED bounding box closely surrounds the scenery library object you want to "exclude" from display, release the Left Mouse button but do not move it; now left-click again on a corner of that bounding box.

You should immediately be presented with a pop-up context menu offering:

* Add to [recently used file name].BGL

* Add to another file... < Browse to existing file; or enter new file name to create a totally new placement BGL >

* Cancel

* Exclusion Rectangle size: ??.? x ??.? M


Choose one of the top 2 items, and when finished, the Exclusion box turns GREEN.

Right-Click the GREEN Exclusion box; you should immediately see a pop-up context menu offering:

* Delete Exclusion Rectangle

* Set Type > Objects and Buildings or Objects, Buildings and Autogen

* Add Exclusion Rectangle

* Cancel


Choose one of the above 2 Exclusion Rectangle 'types'

Exit Instant Scenery, then navigate:

FSX Menu > World > Scenery Library; click [OK] button < FSX refreshes the flight >

The scenery library object you wanted to "exclude" from display should now be 'gone'.



BTW: If you want to Add / Edit Object Properties / Move / Delete a scenery library object placed by a BGL that you personally created, you must first "Open" it in Instant Scenery ...so that it has the 'focus' of IS3; you can then use the Mouse to select (aka "highlight") an object with IS3 for any of those functions.

If you need further assistance, let us know.

GaryGB

 

[kmanning]

="GaryGB, post: 781832, member: 995"]Hi Ken:

If you are trying to delete an object placed by a FS / P3D stock airport BGL, or other default scenery library object placement BGL, you should instead use an Exclusion Rectangle.

Hi Gary,
No, they were not place by FS stock airport bgls. I placed the objects using IS3. The manuals says you can delete objects placed by IS3. The objects I placed are the jetways I've talked about and mentioned that they would not animate, so I'm just going to delete them and use those in ADE. I'm not sure if I did it correctly when I placed the jetways. This airport contains 18 jetways and the way I did it was to place them one at a time at the location where they go. I think I have an idea about why these jetways won't animate. First of all, I checked the xml information for the jetways in ADE, which do animate, and there was one thing I've noticed that was not in the jetway objects I've placed using IS3. Of course, I converted these files to xml so that I could compare them. The jetways I've placed using IS3 does not contain this line:

<Jetway
gateName="GATE"
parkingNumber="x">

Each jetway would have it's own parking gate number where you see the "x", from 2 through 22. These would match the parking spot the plane is parked at. I'm thinking that FS doesn't know what gate number I want it to animate when I use the key command Ctrl+J or GSX because this line is missing and therefore will not do anything. But FS does know what parking spot I'm at. When I placed these jetways, all 18 of them have the same file name and when you look at their xml, they all have the same information with no distinction from the other jetways. I'm just guessing here but I'm thinking about adding that line to the xml and convert back to bgl and see what happens. I need to install these jetways in a way that they're separate and have their own name, so to speak. I guess what I should have done is select "Add to another File."

Launch IS3, Left-click, hold-down, and drag the Mouse button so that the cursor draws a RED bounding box closely surrounding the scenery library object you want to "exclude" from display.

Whenever I exclude an object, does the red box have to be precisely drawn and not touch any other object, and does it have to completely cover the object I want to exclude, or do I just put a small rectangle over the object? Some times, objects will be very close together and it seems that I would need to be careful that the red boundary box does not touch any other object.

By they way, I finally found what I was looking for in the ADE manual regarding exclusions that you and Jon were telling me about. I've read some of it last night but I'm going to go over it a few times to get a good thorough understanding of it. I'm glad I finally found it. It says basically the same things you and Jon discussed with me.

I also want to know about the context menu saying "Add to My Scenery" that I talked about. When I add an object and click the to bring up the context menu, I think it's called, does it suppose to say "Add to My Scenery."?

 

[GaryGB]

http://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/instant-scenery-3.441046/#post-781838

Hi Gary,

No, they were not place by FS stock airport bgls. I placed the objects, which are the jetways, using IS3. I placed them there myself using IS3, and the manuals says you can delete these objects.

OK, those BGLs are certainly OK to edit.

Whenever I exclude an object, does the red box have to be precisely drawn and not touch any other object, and does it have to completely cover the object I want to exclude, or do I just put a small rectangle over the object?

Some times, objects will be very close together and it seems that I would need to be careful that the red boundary box does not touch any other object.

By the way, I finally found what I was looking for in the ADE manual regarding exclusions that you and Jon were telling me about. I've read some of it last night but I'm going to go over it a few times to get a good thorough understanding of it. I'm glad I finally found it. It says basically the same things you and Jon discussed with me.

As Jon described in the ADE thread, it is always a 'best practice' to keep Exclusion Rectangles as small as possible, while still being large enough to intercept the Reference Point (aka "RefPoint") of a 3D MDL (which can be anywhere on the object's base or even in its central datum position), so you're definitely on the right track with your thinking here.

I also want to know about the context menu saying "Add to My Scenery" that I talked about.

When I add an object and click the to bring up the context menu, I think it's called, is it supposed to say "Add to My Scenery" ?

That may just be the way the author labeled the submitted file name in the illustration for the IS3 Manual.

IIRC, only the very first time one uses Instant Scenery does it submit a file name such as either "MyScenery.BGL" or "InstantScenery.BGL"; I forget exactly what the original submitted name was, but it does not matter.

Once one has used any name other than the original one IS3 submits in which to save a placement, that 'most recently used' BGL name will be the one which is submitted in the context menu during the very next IS3 session launched in FS.

One does NOT have to use that name or BGL; but, it is a 'best practice' to only group together scenery library object placements by project area (typically ex: related to a nearby airport ICAO) ...as GMAN suggested above in this thread.

One should therefore NOT group together scenery library object placements for different Geographic areas separated by more than the size of an airport project test radius (IIRC around 9 or 10 miles).

Thus, IMHO, except for a "regional" scenery project which is not necessarily related to a particular airport, when one needs to place scenery library objects more than 9 or 10 miles away from the existing group of airport-related objects already placed by a BGL created in IS3, one should create a new BGL for placement of any distant objects.

GaryGB

 

[kmanning]

Hi Gary,

I still need to know why I cannot delete the objects I placed in IS3. The manual says to simply point the mouse over the object and when it highlights in red, you right click and click Delete Object, but it's not highlighting in red when I point the mouse over the jetway. Why won't they highlight in red when I point my mouse over the jetways?

Ken.