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Official ARP's and more...

L

larshgf

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It is about Airport Reference Points: "real world" compared to p3d (extracted with Pete Dowson's runway.exe program)
All from Greece.

My "real world source: World Aero Data / http://worldaerodata.com
My p3d data as mentioned a list made of the prg "runway.exe" as I expect the airport coordinates in this list to be the ARP's

I have computed the deviations (distance and course) of the P3D default airports. When I compare these values with top-down views of the airports in a new photoreal scenery of Greece, I sometimes find an explanation of the deviation of the default p3d airports compared to the photoreal (which I imagine must be the correct and fit to the real world coordinates). But unfortunately in many cases not.

2 questions:
- where do I find the most reliable ARP coordinates for the real world airports ?
- is the airport coordinates from the list made by Pete Dowsons program "runway.exe" really the ARP (airport reference points)?

And a final question:
- can I expect that the location of the airports in a photoreal scenery fits to the real world coordinates?

I know its an obsessive, nerdy project, but I must admit that getting different result is a bit frustrating. THERE MUST BE CORRECT ARP VALUES FOR AIRPORTS somewhere on the internet.

Best Regards, Lars
 
Hi,

Let's start with the last question. It depends on how the photoreal is made if you can expect it to be accurate or not. If the developer of the photoreal didn't consider the coordinate system and the projection of the imagery data used, it is possible that the photoreal is at the wrong location. If the developer did that correctly, then I think you can consider the airport locations in the photoreal accurate.

I don't think it is required that the ARP in the scenery and on the airport diagram match. So it could be possible that a different location has been chosen as ARP in FS. So a deviation doesn't always have to be a problem. In the end it is more the runway locations that matter.
 
I tried to check my newly purchased greek photoreal scenery with help from Google map (which include a coordinate tool) and the scenery was pretty accurate (I guess I should not consider a 30 meter deviation to be a problem?).
I found out that the aerodrome papers (www.ypa.gr - for Greece) include ARP and even more accurate Threshold Coordinates for the runways. It comes from the national airport authorities so the values aught to be accurate!

Many of the P3D default airports must be moved in order to fit to my new scenery. But with ADE (including ProKey) this is not a big problem). I just wonder if the Navaids for the airport is included in the "move airport" function in ADE so that one can count on the ILS, VOR's etc?
 
I would consider a 30 meter deviation a big problem already, that's about a runway width :). You can place photo scenery much more accurate than that.

But using threshold data sounds like a good approach. Make sure that your approach plates use the same coordinate system as FS. I somehow remember that Greek data had some differences. But I can't remember where I read that.
 
In order to check a photorealistic scenery I have compared the coordinates of the rwy threshold (estimated) Google Earth and P3D (by slewing).

Just to show you I have witten down ICAO, 2 sets of coordinates plus the distance and course (Great Circle equation):

/// Photorealistisk Scenery test \\\
LGSM|Google Earth|37,688307|26,923686|P3D_Scenery|37,688443|26,923693|31|0 (31 = afstand i meter / 0 = retning)
LGIK|Google Earth|37,677927|26,350263|P3D_Scenery|37,677965|26,350291|22|270
LGKO|Google Earth|36,785443|27,098188|P3D_Scenery|36,785461|27,098247|5|90
LGRP|Google Earth|36,400360|28,069085|P3D_Scenery|36,400380|28,069195|0|0
LGKP|Google Earth|35,415880|27,154982|P3D_Scenery|35,415858|27,155082|18|270
LGIR|Google Earth|35,341008|25,161346|P3D_Scenery|35,341057|25,161370|3|90
LGSA|Google Earth|35,525752|24,168041|P3D_Scenery|35,525802|24,168123|18|270

So Samos airport (LGSM) is displaced 31 meters wrong in Northern direction, Ikaria (LGIK) 22 meters in western direction etc.

More comparisons can be made of course. I dont have any experience in evaluationg photoreal sceneries. Ideally there should be no displacing what so ever.
Bu that might be utopic?
 
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