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PBR materials and MSFS2020

C

Cédrice

Resource contributor
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359
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france
Shouldn't the models in MSFS be exclusively PBR material ? is it not the rule of MSFS2020 ?
Because I see a lot of third-party developer scenery with non-PBR models...
What are the consequences of this? that would effect the sim ?

Happy New Year everyone
Cedrice
 
Hi,

Any model made in gltf has pbr materials by default indeed. So only if old FSX models are used non-pbr materials could be used.
 
Hi Arno:

If we have a 3D scenery object as a FSX / P3D *.MDL format source that we are perfectly happy with because it has photo-real image texture materials that have AO and other surface details all baked-in, must we use FSX Compatibility Mode, or can we instead just use a glTFv2.x 3D model exported from MCX ? :oops:

Does MCX not have an ability to export such a 3D model using a basic template for photo-real non-PBR attributes ...as a glTFv2.x ? :scratchch

GaryGB
 
In this principle, even a simple Albedo map used as a Diff* would be PBR ?
There are a multitude of maps for the PBR.
For the Flight simulation Métal and Normal gives very good result
 
Of course I don't know the details of the MSFS shader, but I think if we only apply a albedo map (using an FSX/P3D diffuse texture), it would still use the PBR material flow (just without any metallic or roughness). I haven't seen any mention in the SDK that we can choose to have a PBR or non-PBR material (like we can in P3D v4). In the glTF file we can only specify a PBR material and I don't know how close just an albedo map is to the old way with only a diffuse map.
 
Hi there,

For my understanding of PBR in MSFS, it is not enough to simply assign the Flight Simulator Material of the MSFS to a 3-D model via a Diffuse Map. For me, a 3-D model is only a PBR Model if a Composite Map and a Normal Map are assigned to the Diffuse Map. And only the Composite Map in combination with the Normal Map makes a model "alive". Lively in the sense that only then do the special PBR effects come into play. With PBR effects the dynamic reflections, the light and sun reflections, the light scattering etc. are meant.


The PBR models should therefore have at least three textures:

msfs_pbr_textures_slots.jpg msfs_pbr_textures.jpg

- Base Color Map
- Comp map
- Normal Map
- Emissive Map (optional)

The Base Color is the Diffuse Map (also called Albedo). The Composite Map contains information about the Gloss, Reflections (Metal, Plastic, etc.). The Normal Map contains information about the light scattering. Without these Textures, a 3-D Model is not a full-fledged PBR Model.

So much for my understanding of PBR in MSFS.
 
Hi Christian,
Are you using an independent Normal map ?
I saw that some put it in the red and green, channel the blue channel would be for the metalic map...
You put Roug, Occ, Met on your composite map on which channel do you attribute them ?
 
arno said:
Of course I don't know the details of the MSFS shader, but I think if we only apply a albedo map (using an FSX/P3D diffuse texture), it would still use the PBR material flow (just without any metallic or roughness). I haven't seen any mention in the SDK that we can choose to have a PBR or non-PBR material (like we can in P3D v4). In the glTF file we can only specify a PBR material and I don't know how close just an albedo map is to the old way with only a diffuse map.
Click to expand...
This is good to know because there are always elements of scenery that don't need a lot of details, like the effects of a Normal map or other.
 
Cédrice said:
I saw that some put it in the red and green, channel the blue channel would be for the metalic map...
Click to expand...
That sounds like X-Plane to me. There the PBR information is combined with the normal map. But MSFS and P3D don't do that, they have separate normal maps and combined maps for the PBR.
 
arno said:
That sounds like X-Plane to me. There the PBR information is combined with the normal map. But MSFS and P3D don't do that, they have separate normal maps and combined maps for the PBR.
Click to expand...
Thank Arno it seems clearer in my head
The combined map must be OA in red channel / Roughness green channel / Metalic blue channel
 
Cédrice said:
Hi Christian,
Are you using an independent Normal map ?
I saw that some put it in the red and green, channel the blue channel would be for the metalic map...
You put Roug, Occ, Met on your composite map on which channel do you attribute them ?
Click to expand...
I created the normal map in Photoshop using the Nvidia Photoshop PlugIn (Nvidia Tools):

photoshop_normal_map.jpg

I use photo textures, the channel distribution of the comp map is:

R: white
G: roughness
B: metal

photoshop_comp_map.jpg

For building windows, so that the surroundings are reflected in them and light reflections occur, the windows in the G-channel are made completely black, while in the B-channel they are completely white.
 
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