• Which the release of FS2020 we see an explosition of activity on the forun and of course we are very happy to see this. But having all questions about FS2020 in one forum becomes a bit messy. So therefore we would like to ask you all to use the following guidelines when posting your questions:

    • Tag FS2020 specific questions with the MSFS2020 tag.
    • Questions about making 3D assets can be posted in the 3D asset design forum. Either post them in the subforum of the modelling tool you use or in the general forum if they are general.
    • Questions about aircraft design can be posted in the Aircraft design forum
    • Questions about airport design can be posted in the FS2020 airport design forum. Once airport development tools have been updated for FS2020 you can post tool speciifc questions in the subforums of those tools as well of course.
    • Questions about terrain design can be posted in the FS2020 terrain design forum.
    • Questions about SimConnect can be posted in the SimConnect forum.

    Any other question that is not specific to an aspect of development or tool can be posted in the General chat forum.

    By following these guidelines we make sure that the forums remain easy to read for everybody and also that the right people can find your post to answer it.

FSXA Questions About QGIS

The abbreviation for Scenery Solutions Ultimate Terrain USA (originally released for FS9) upgraded version for FSX as Ultimate Terrain X was "UTX".

Oh, okay. I think I understand now. UTX is Ultimate Terrain. I thought UTX was for things like power lines and utilities. So, I guess I had the wrong idea about that. It's been a long time since I've used FS9.


This screenshot shows CVX Vectors from that product are also "jagged" (popular technical term in computer graphics: "aliased"); thus my statement:

"Even higher fidelity CVX Vectors of Ultimate Terrain are "aliased", and now look too jagged compared to IRL, so one may edit UTX objects, too."

View attachment 97926

I think I got it now. I agree. The "Stream Lines Perrenial" is jagged and I had already removed those jagged streams a few days ago. Anyway, here's the way my scenery looks now, and I think this is what you're looking for:


Current Image_1.jpg



Here's the top view:

Current Image_2.jpg



I've also edit the airport boundary so that it's next to the road because it was leaving a gap between the road and the airport boundary. I've also edited the fence in ADE. But it looks like the fence moved slightly since editing the airport boundary, and I'm checking on that now. I wish the large fence could be added in SbuilderX. I've googled it and it says that SbuilderX allows for adding a fence but I don't see any textures for that, unless a fence texture must be added to SbuilderX, and I haven't found how to do that. I've typed Fence in the help search box but nothing turns up. Here's the screenshot:


Current image_3.jpg




The screenshot above shows persistence of a Stream texture along one side of a Hydro Polygon; I see no shorelines in your *.SBP attached above.
There is a vastpick-list of shoreline types in SBuilderX; I suggest testing ones which are straight, thin, and have no "waves" for inland use at KBHM.


GaryGB

Yes, I'll attach the shorelines shortly. Remember, if I've sent you any streams - STX files, just ignore those and I have removed the streams. I think it looks better with it.

Ken.
 
Oh, okay. I think I understand now. UTX is Ultimate Terrain. I thought UTX was for things like power lines and utilities. So, I guess I had the wrong idea about that. It's been a long time since I've used FS9.

Ultimate Terrain USA (aka "UT USA" was for FS9; Ultimate Terrain X (aka "UTX") was for FSX.


There is indeed a FS2Kx SDK CVX Vector type for Utilities which has the prefix "UTX".

https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/p...msdn.10)?redirectedfrom=MSDN#the-shp2vec-tool


If we use Patrick Germain's CvxExtractor GUI on CVX2420.BGL we can write out ESRI Shapefiles for all CVX Vector types, including the "UTX" type.

These ESRI Shapefiles, as you may know, can all be Appended to SBuilderX, (1) at a time so that any number of them are seen in the workspace.

Normally we view these (with no edit function) by loading CVX2420.BGL in SDK TMFViewer.


I think I got it now. I agree. The "Stream Lines Perennial" is jagged and I had already removed those jagged streams a few days ago. Anyway, here's the way my scenery looks now, and I think this is what you're looking for:


View attachment 97936


Here's the top view:

View attachment 97937


I've also edit the airport boundary so that it's next to the road because it was leaving a gap between the road and the airport boundary.

OK, I'll see that when you next attach a ZIP of your latest *.SBP and *.SBX

I've also edited the fence in ADE. But it looks like the fence moved slightly since editing the airport boundary, and I'm checking on that now.
I wish the large fence could be added in SBuilderX. I've googled it and it says that SBuilderX allows for adding a fence but I don't see any textures for that, unless a fence texture must be added to SBuilderX, and I haven't found how to do that. I've typed Fence in the help search box but nothing turns up. Here's the screenshot:


View attachment 97938

It will be best to make the fence using FenceBuilder by Don Grovestine if you want anything beyond the (2) basic fences initially offered by ADE.

I'll post a link when I find the final release version of that utility which Don provided after we finished the latter Beta testing phase.

I'll need to look for my copy of the Fence Tutorial by Luis Feliz-Tirado to refresh my memory on the Fence options available via SBuilderX

Yes, I'll attach the shorelines shortly. Remember, if I've sent you any streams - STX files, just ignore those and I have removed the streams. I think it looks better with it.

I like the CVX HL Stream textured Poly-Line which has an almost too-winding course; I hope to find out how to make its water color area "Hydro".

GaryGB
 
Last edited:
You are making further good progress. :)

Later, after it is decided as to how to configure the updated ABP (FLX2420), we will add the creek bed terrain shape to the otherwise flat ABP surface.

You should probably also add in Hydro content seen on aerial imagery IRL, such as the drainage ditches near RWY-24 and along 68th St. North.


Later, there may be airfield areas not traversed by AI aircraft or ground Vehicles that can have their IRL terrain shapes added to KBHM ABP surfaces.

I believe it would be a good idea to now proceed with Sampling / Smoothing the Roads at KBHM, and aligning them precisely with aerial imagery IRL.


Because CVX Vector object types are separate rather than custom Meta-object types (called "Vector Autogen") when extracted from CVX2420.BGL:

* Utilities (UTX) will require alignment after Roads are aligned with aerial imagery IRL

* FreewayTrafficRoads (FWX) will require alignment after Roads are aligned with aerial imagery IRL


GaryGB
 
Last edited:
Hi Gary,

I don't think including a shoreline to this narrow creek is going to work since the shoreline width cannot be adjust. This creek is not but about 5 meters, or less in width, and the shoreline texture covers every bit of the water poly. If there's no way around this, I think I should not include the shoreline. Here's a screenshot:


Narrow Creek.jpg




I think I've found a shoreline, with a different name, that works fairly good:

Creek with another shoreline.jpg



Ken.
 
Last edited:
These will look better when they are draped into the sloped ground recess of the creek bed after they have been inserted into the AB Flatten surface.


You can more easily pre-visualize available Shoreline texture options associated with SBuilderX' long pick-list using XnViewMP to Browse this sub-folder: :idea:

https://www.xnview.com/en/xnview-mp/

[SBuilderX install path]\Tools\BMPs


Keep up the good work. :)


PS: By now you may recognize you are gradually building a KBHM 3D TIN-based G-Poly, comparable to the one you grappled with in FSDT's KDFW. ;)

GaryGB
 
Last edited:
Here's my road vector files for the freeways. I only aligned the freeways just south of the airport because it would take a month, or more, to do all of it. I can always do the rest later. I've also used the Smooth feature to smooth out the curves. What's the next project?

Ken.
 

Attachments

IIUC, you also wanted Roads not present in FSX default for old & new East Lake Blvd. and Roads within / immediately around Meadwood Heights ?

Until I derive old Topo map terrain contours, we will not do terrain mesh extensions for a historic KBHM version, but IMHO, nearby Roads are a must.

Even though we may defer the KBHM historic version re-construction until later, you would want to have current nearby Roads in place for reference.



When the SBuilderX phase of work with Appended ESRI Shapes is done, the saved work will be extracted and imported to Sketchup for other work.

If the tracing of aerial imagery with CVX Vectors is precise, you could eliminate at least 1/2 of the work required to make the airfield match IRL.


We are going to do terra-forming on the AB Flatten surface that will be part of your 3D TIN G-Poly, so you would want the airfield Roads too.

We will involve doing Sketchup 'Push-Pull Tool' work using imported Road CVX Vector shapes to assist in building the KBHM surface geometry.

GaryGB
 
Last edited:
IIUC, you also wanted Roads not present in FSX default for old & new East Lake Blvd. and Roads within / immediately around Meadwood Heights ?

Yes, I do. But the roads around Meadwood Heights no longer exists. I would have to get access to an accurate old map going back to the 1970s or 1980s. I also remembered that I never did named my road project.

Until I derive old Topo map terrain contours, we will not do terrain mesh extensions for a historic KBHM version, but IMHO, nearby Roads are a must.

Okay. So do I still need to do more work on the road project and how far out do I need to go?

When doing this project, I set the vector width to matched the width in the image. The problem is that sometimes, the width changes over a distance. You'll also notice that the photo image shows 3 or 4 lanes and the entry and exit ramps show 1 or 2 lanes. I've also noticed that there are no textures for 3, 5, nor 7 lanes but only 2, 4, 6 ,8 and 10. Another problem is that the default road vectors are so cluttered up with so many line vectors that it makes it more difficult and takes up so much time.

Even though we may defer the KBHM historic version re-construction until later, you would want to have current nearby Roads in place for reference.

Okay.

When the SBuilderX phase of work with Appended ESRI Shapes is done, the saved work will be extracted and imported to Sketchup for other work.

Looking forward to it.

If the tracing of aerial imagery with CVX Vectors is precise, you could eliminate at least 1/2 of the work required to make the airfield match IRL.

Well, if you're referring to the roads and the freeway south of the airport, it's not precise or right on the money, but just by visually looking at the road vectors along with the photo image, it's probably accurate to within 100 feet.

We are going to do terra-forming on the AB Flatten surface that will be part of your 3D TIN G-Poly, so you would want the airfield Roads too.

When you say airfield roads, do you mean the roads inside the airport boundaries or those that go immediately around the airport boundaries?

We will involve doing Sketchup 'Push-Pull Tool' work using imported Road CVX Vector shapes to assist in building the KBHM surface geometry.

Okay

Ken.
 
Last edited:
Yes, I do. But the roads around Meadwood Heights no longer exists. I would have to get access to an accurate old map going back to the 1970s or 1980s.

AFAIK, we already have the data required based on the years you stated were of interest to you as a local resident, and when you actually moved.

Also, the ANG military history web page cites dates of local changes in the pertinent part of Meadwood at least a year after you reportedly moved.


I have located USGS Topographic maps from 1959 and mid-to later 1970's (with a few revision dates in between) which are up to 1:24,000 Geo-PDFs.

Unfortunately USGS no longer distributes, the other file formats that actually provided contour data separate from graphic images of other objects.


While not optimal, these can be 'Raster to Vector' converted in a GIS application and/or Sketchup after pre-processing in a graphics application.

Resulting contour vectors can be processed to make Geo-refernced TINs and/or Terrain Mesh extending current data to Meadwood as old terrain.

I also remembered that I never did name my road project.

Which Road project ...the current one attached immediately above ? :scratchch

Okay. So do I still need to do more work on the road project and how far out do I need to go?
When you say airfield roads, do you mean the roads inside the airport boundaries or those that go immediately around the airport boundaries?

I suggest including all Roads on-airfield and those immediately surrounding, including the current ANG and all of current Meadwood Heights.

Also, to assist with integrating an eventual terrain extension restoring Road(s) where you lived in 1970's, include:

* Tarrant City

* Oak Lawn

*Airport Highlands.

When doing this project, I set the vector width to matched the width in the image. The problem is that sometimes, the width changes over a distance. You'll also notice that the photo image shows 3 or 4 lanes and the entry and exit ramps show 1 or 2 lanes. I've also noticed that there are no textures for 3, 5, nor 7 lanes but only 2, 4, 6 ,8 and 10.

That is a valid point, as in the Modified Terrain.Cfg with or without UTX installed, we see only 1, 2, 4, 6, 8, 10 Lane Roads.

Try to copy/paste/move existing Road Poly-Lines; place additional number of needed lanes alongside ex: 2+1=3, 3+2=5, 6 + 1 = 7.


SBuilderX Menu > Help > {Search} Tab > query string: Move > click [List Topics] button > click all listed items to view all hits

Note especially SBuilderX' Help section: Working with Points, Lines and Polygons > Move > Selecting and moving the whole Line

"If you click with the Left Mouse on the segment of a Line you select the whole Line. Then you can move it (dragging with the mouse), delete it, copy it, paste it, etc. If you click with the Right Mouse on the segment of a Line you get access to its Properties."


It will be easier to do this in SBuilderX than in Sketchup, and it allows creating / editing AFD infrastructure and custom AI A/C and/or Ground Traffic.

[EDITED]

Another problem is that the default road vectors are so cluttered up with so many line vectors that it makes it more difficult and takes up so much time.

Remember, to inspect only new CVX Vectors as you work, insert a big CVX Vector Exclude Polygon below your new work Area layer in Scenery.Cfg.

That should exclude default and other 3rd party CVX Vectors from layers below your new work ...from being rendered in FSX at run time.

[END_EDIT]

Well, if you're referring to the roads and the freeway south of the airport, it's not precise or right on the money, but just by visually looking at the road vectors along with the photo image, it's probably accurate to within 100 feet.

CVX Vector ESRI Shapefiles SBuilderX used for BGLs extracted/imported to Sketchup become primitives' for 3D objects; Max. precision is needed!

GaryGB
 
Last edited:
AFAIK, we already have the data required based on the years you stated were of interest to you as a local resident, and when you actually moved.

You did sent me a map of roads a few years back but I can't find it. I have it stored somewhere. Maybe it's on my external drive.

Also, the ANG military history web page cites dates of local changes in the pertinent part of Meadwood at least a year after you reportedly moved.

It was after my grandpa pasted away in 1989. My grandmother moved from that location to another house in the same general location. In 1974, my grandparents moved out of that house to -----. It was their house. In 1974 we've moved in that house and lived there from 1974 to 1977. A few years later, they moved back into the same house around the late 70s and lived there until my grandpa passed away in 1989. It was after that time when the ANG bought the property. So, that house was there until at least the 1990s.

I have located USGS Topographic maps from 1959 and mid-to later 1970's (with a few revision dates in between) which are up to 1:24,000 Geo-PDFs.

Those would be fine, especially those from the 1970s and I like to have copies of them.


Which Road project ...the current one attached immediately above ?

Actually what I meant was that I did not rename the bgl file but I do have the project file name saved. It should be KBHM_Road_Vector.SBP.

I suggest including all on-airfield Roads and those immediately surrounding the airfield, including the current ANG and all of current Meadwood.

Okay.

CVX Vector ESRI Shapefiles SBuilderX used to make BGLs extracted/imported to Sketchup will become primitives' for 3D objects; precision is needed!

Yes, I agree. When I stated that roads were out of alignment by about 100 feet, I was referring to the default RDX road file and they are not aligned perfectly to the image. In my project, I try to align them right to the image. The freeways are much more difficult you have lanes that constantly change, you have side lanes that exit the freeway, and they're all chopped up. I'll work on those roads.

Ken.
 
You did sent me a map of roads a few years back but I can't find it. I have it stored somewhere. Maybe it's on my external drive.
Those would be fine, especially those from the 1970s and I like to have copies of them.

https://www.mediafire.com/file/e1brudc2u0b8aeq/AL_Irondale_304262_1959_24000_geo_pdf.zip/file

https://www.mediafire.com/file/l4wt...gham+North_303240_1959_24000_geo_pdf.zip/file


You 'may' be able to open both of these GeoPDF's in QGIS; if so, try to disable display of "Collars" from the outer borders of each Topo map section.


I'm not sure yet how to do the same in Google nor how to also make them terrain mesh clinging within that app.


I may attempt to convert these 2 old Topos into a merged GeoTIFF and make a version of it as aerial imagery to drape onto LIDAR terrain in FSX.
:idea:



A GeoTIFF can be saved as a BMP, a TXT world file made; then SBuilderX > Add Map From Disk (Calibrate is skipped if one already has a TXT file).

It was after my grandpa pasted away in 1989. My grandmother moved from that location to another house in the same general location. In 1974, my grandparents moved out of that house to -----. It was their house. In 1974 we've moved in that house and lived there from 1974 to 1977. A few years later, they moved back into the same house around the late 70s and lived there until my grandpa passed away in 1989. It was after that time when the ANG bought the property. So, that house was there until at least the 1990s.

If the property was not modified for ANG until 1990's, we may find more recent data as a reference for terrain / imagery at the residence location.

IIUC, however, you stated your target years for KBHM historic version was the 1970's; what year do you want to made the old version of KBHM for ?

Yes, I agree. When I stated that roads were out of alignment by about 100 feet, I was referring to the default RDX road file and they are not aligned perfectly to the image. In my project, I try to align them right to the image. The freeways are much more difficult you have lanes that constantly change, you have side lanes that exit the freeway, and they're all chopped up. I'll work on those roads.

Note the subsequent edit I made to add the relatively small number of surrounding Roads in adjacent neighborhoods listed on the old Topos.

Note also, the subsequent edit I made in my prior post above.

https://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/questions-about-qgis.460216/post-936230

GaryGB
 
Last edited:
IIUC, however, you stated your target years for KBHM historic version was the 1970's; what year do you want to made the old version of KBHM for ?

I like to have the year 1973 and 1986. But any time period between 1970 through 1986 should be fine. Thanks for the maps.

Ken.
 
Hi Gary,

Here's are the road vectors for the Meadwood Heights on the north side of the airport and roads inside the airport boundaries.

Ken.
 

Attachments

Last edited:
Hi Gary,

Haven't heard from you and I guess you were waiting for my freeway traffic project. I have the FWX2420.shp finally finished. I only worked on the freeways as far east as Trussville and as far west as I-65, as well as north and south a few miles. I've tried it out in FSX and it looks much better than the default but the traffic seems to move way too fast. According to a google search, LWcfg.SPB default is set to 100kph or about 60mph. I assume it uses kilometers per hour and not miles per hour. But the traffic appears to move much faster than 60 mph. I've downloaded the SPB2XML but I've cannot find a converter that will convert it back to .spb. I've numbered their lanes as they appear in the photo image. What's the next project?

Here is the zipped file below.

Ken.
 

Attachments

Last edited:
Hi Ken:

I'll take a look at your Freeway Traffic project shortly.

UPDATE: Good idea to do the outlying major Roads first, as there may be some changes needed local to KBHM itself.

There are a few misaligned FWX CVX Vectors with traffic driving on the shoulder and/or embankment in your attached project that you may wish to fix in the future to align properly with aerial imagery.

Be aware that you can derive 'single' Poly-lines from Roads after aligned, to make Freeway Traffic via SBuilderX Copy / Paste / Convert / Edit / Move.


I have created contours for 1959 Meadwood Heights from Topos, and am testing a workflow to locally adapt the current LIDAR DTM for a historic version.

For optimal terrain blending, I am studying KBHM in MSFS to see how best to adapt that method to both ABP and KBHM as a whole ...for FSX / P3D.


FYI: Jim Vile and Fr. Bill Leaming (aka "n4gix") posted info on setting CVX Vector Freeway Traffic speed in FSX (distinct from 'AI' Ground Vehicle speed):

https://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/how-to-adjust-speed-for-car-traffic-in-fsx.13250/page-2


As for a 'next step' with CVX Vectors, decide if you are satisfied with street lighting / telephone poles associated with Roads as "Vector Autogen", and whether it needs to be changed; if so that may be done via further modification of Terrain.Cfg (See: LFT's Tutorial "Fun With Lines")


Also you should decide whether you need to align / edit Utilities (CVX = "UTX") as corridors with- or without- power pylons; if so, any needed customization may also be done via further modification of Terrain.Cfg.

[EDITED]

I believe you already know Railways (CVX = "RRX") and Rail Yards are a major feature at / near KBHM; they may require re-alignment / editing as well.

[END_EDIT]

And of course, you way wish to align / edit Parks (CVX = "PKX") such as East Lake Park near the approach to KBHM RWY 24 ...to be more like IRL.

GaryGB
 
Last edited:
Hi Ken:

There are a few misaligned FWX CVX Vectors you may wish to fix in the future to align with aerial imagery.

Are those the ones I worked on or edited? If so, could you point them out. Just to let you know, the darker blue line vectors are the ones I've worked on. The default, or lighter blue are the ones I have not worked on.

FYI: Jim Vile and Fr. Bill Leaming (aka "n4gix") posted info on setting CVX Vector Freeway Traffic speed in FSX (distinct from 'AI' Ground Vehicle speed):

https://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/how-to-adjust-speed-for-car-traffic-in-fsx.13250/page-2

Thanks for the links. I've already downloaded the SPB2XML tool from Fly Away Simulations. It converts the spb file to an xml. But do I still need to compile it back to a spb file? If so, where can I get the tool because I haven't been able to find it.

Ken.
 
I'll see if I can capture the misaligned FWX Vectors in screenshots with coordinates.

In the past, on slower computers, FSX would have had a slight performance benefit from compiling the *.SPB XML source code to actual *.SPB file format, but nearly all of us now have performance to spare in more powerful computers, so reportedly you do not need to compile the edited XML.

I will need to refresh my memory on which SDK or 3rd party compiler I used many years ago to process my edited XML to *.SPB format.

https://www.google.com/search?q=site:+www.fsdeveloper.com+"FSX"+SPB+compiler&sca_esv=e03ed720f0fdf65a&ei=DobvaNbEE-iE0PEPkIio2Ao&ved=0ahUKEwjWg6C6jaaQAxVoAjQIHRAECqsQ4dUDCBA&uact=5&oq=site:+www.fsdeveloper.com+"FSX"+SPB+compiler&gs_lp=Egxnd3Mtd2l6LXNlcnAiLHNpdGU6IHd3dy5mc2RldmVsb3Blci5jb20gIkZTWCIgU1BCIGNvbXBpbGVyMgUQABjvBTIIEAAYgAQYogQyBRAAGO8FMgUQABjvBUjuJlDLDVjaH3ABeACQAQCYAX-gAekBqgEDMC4yuAEDyAEA-AEBmAIDoAKUAsICCBAAGLADGO8FwgILEAAYgAQYsAMYogSYAwCIBgGQBgSSBwMxLjKgB9oEsgcDMC4yuAeCAsIHAzMtM8gHHw&sclient=gws-wiz-serp


Of incidental and somewhat related interest was the discovery Devinci shared with us here:

https://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/solution-to-change-default-ground-vehicles.71080/

GaryGB
 
Last edited:
I'll see if I can capture the misaligned FWX Vectors in screenshots with coordinates.

I am having major issues getting FSUIPC aircraft position data updated promptly / if at all ...in SBuilderX' map view with "Show Aircraft" active.

So, nope, I will not have the time to do this; besides, it would be best to defer that until you have finished aligning and editing all your Roads first.

GaryGB
 
I am having major issues getting FSUIPC aircraft position data updated promptly / if at all ...in SBuilderX' map view with "Show Aircraft" active.

So, nope, I will not have the time to do this; besides, it would be best to defer that until you have finished aligning and editing all your Roads first.

GaryGB

I don't understand what you're referring to. I have already aligned the roads around the airport area. Do you mean I need to go back and aligned the RDX vectors again? I don't understand why they're not aligned. What about the FWX vectors. Did you capture the FWX vectors with a screenshot and coordinates? When you say "aligning and editing ALL the roads, do you mean I need to align every road that's in the shp file, even those miles away from the airport? I like to know why the roads I've already aligned are not aligned.

By the way, there's one thing that concerns me. When I align these vectors, I'm using google earth, not Virual Earth. I don't think that should make a difference, but I have noticed that when using google satellite, the image would change position slighty after I have made an alignment from a previous zoom, such as 18, 19, or 20. I have it aligned perfectly at zoom 19, for example, and when I zoom to 20, the line vector is off slightly, not because I've moved the vector line but because the image itself has shifted slightly. They also have a bad habit of not aligning their own maps when merging them and using different seasons. They are really crappy about this. But as I've said, the shift in the image is only slight.

Ken.
 
Last edited:
Back
Top