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FSXA Resistant norwegian vegetation

hotelfox

hotelfox

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germany
We all know that Norway is famous for its extended mangrove forests ;)

You want to see them? Well - let me tell you where!

Today I took my Twotter for a nice pleasant flight from ENBN to ENRA, Rossvoll.
After touch-down on RWY 32 I took the first exit to park my aircraft on the apron. I had to stop because of some conifer trees blocking that TWY. 'Well', I thought, 'one of these airports again where MS didn' t pay the lumberjacks'.

I started ADE and got this result:

edit: two files removed (see upgraded files in my post from July 13)

As far as I can judge, some trees are gone, but others seem to be extremely resistant norwegian kind of vegetation.

Ah, yes, and the previously mentioned mangrove forests can be seen all around ENRA ...

Does anybody own a digital 'STIHL' which cuts even that kind of trees?
 
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ENRA - trees within Airport Background

Hi Scott!

That' s funny - I have plenty of trees within the boundaries of the Airport Background.

ADE_ENRA_trees_02.jpg ADE_ENRA_trees_03.jpg

The only difference to 'normal' trees - I can taxi through them without crashing the plane!

Maybe this is also interesting for you, Jon (setting of the Airport Background: Flatten Mask Class Map ExcludeAutoGen) Usually I get a perfectly 'clean' airport area without any vegetation!?
 
With SP2, I get the trees on the airport background and on the nearby water, as well. It's probably caused by a rogue BGL in the default BGLs, but it would take some detective work to find it... sometimes a BGL far removed from the lat-long will cause this kind of problem. It may not even be in the same folder.

Dick
 
I had to do a reinstall of FSX from the ground up, so along the way, I compared ENRA's autogen ( both in the parking area and in the nearby water ).

RTM and SP1 are fine, even though some scenery files were changed in the 0601 folder by SP1. 0601 is the directory that holds the ENRA scenery.

SP2 shows the out of place autogen. SP2 didn't alter any of the contents of 0601.

It looks like the terrain engine changes of SP2 causes the problem... which is not good news. That would be a bug, and there might not be a way to fix this.

Dick
 
Interesting. My system is sp1 but I have a test install of sp2 on Vista 64 and see that the autogen seems to be messed up in that area. I see a lot of trees in the water (autogen set full right).

scott s.
.
 
Hi,

I have sp2. It reminds me of the boundary fence problem because the trees appear and disappear when I zoom in and out and under certain view angles.
This at least happens on my PC.
Edit: apparently you can remedy this situation by adding a lanclass/ airfield1 polygon to the airport.
 
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The problem is related to autogen vegitation changes after SP1, so SP2 and Acceleration are affected.

Specifically, the landclass value 60 ( Small Leaf Mixed Woods ) has a problem, not only with airport backgrounds, but with water as well. ESUT has the same problem as ENRA, and the water shows it well.

Simply writing a new airport background will not solve the water problem. It probably needs a new landclass BGL to resolve this.

Of course, none of this has anything to do with ADE.

Dick
 
robystar said:
Hi,

... the trees appear and disappear when I zoom in and out and under certain view angles.
This at least happens on my PC.
Edit: apparently you can remedy this situation by adding a lanclass/ airfield1 polygon to the airport.
Click to expand...

Exactly what I had observed, Robystar!

I just added the landclass/airfiled1 polygon to my file and - you' re right - some more trees are gone! Interesting enough - 'some more' - but still there are trees within the area of the airport background ...

As I said: extremely resistant norwegian kind of vegetation ;) !

For everybody who might be interested - I' ll upload the updated files of ENRA underneath. Still not perfect, but atleast a little bit better than the default file, I think (TWY width according to AIP Norway).

View attachment ENRA_ADE_hf_1.BGL
View attachment ENRA_ADE_hf_1_CVX.bgl

Thank you very much everybody!
 
The autogen vegetation assigned to landclass #60 is different for SP2. It fills the area with clumps of trees, rather than single trees. These trees are bunched in the autogen's MDL, and cannot be changed. There may also be a contributing problem caused by the sharp slope to the east of the river... slopes in FSX ( and FS9 ) can cause several odd problems.

As a result, you must exclude, or overwrite the area with a polygon much larger than the exact borders of the water or airport background area. The new poly must be large enough to envelope the center refpoint of each the autogen MDL offenders.

If you exclude a large enough area with a new poly, then you'll get rid of the trees.

If you paint a different landclass as a poly, it will also get rid of the trees. Your airfield 1 poly is doing this... you just need to make it larger. I used a wooded tundra, and it worked just fine, and it added trees that WERE excluded properly by the default airport background.

Best of all, a newlandclass BGL that uses a different number than 60 would solve the problem. That gets rid of the #60 landclass altogether.

The problem exists at more than one airport, and most probably more than one river or lake.

The problem:
ENRA_default.PNG


My solution using a woody tundra polygon:
ENRA_polyfix.PNG


My_ENRA_solution.PNG


Dick
 
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Dick,

I will have to digest those last comments of yours.
(Hope I won't get sick to the stomach:).
Would you please have a look at the boundary fence problem thread earlier on as well, because the 'symptoms' were the same and you might be close to a solution for that as well.

Roby
 
rhumbaflappy said:
My solution using a woody tundra polygon:
ENRA_polyfix.PNG


Dick
Click to expand...

Your modification looks like the perfect substitute, Dick! Which tool did you use (I guess SBuilder X)? And, did you touch the water polygon as well (to remove the trees)?
 
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Hi,

I do not seem to have any luck with changing the LC of the surrounding area. it gives me all kinds of different LC's on top of eachother.
True the autogen trees are gone but they are also completely gone when I increase the size of the airportbackground airfield a little bit more.
Funny thing is that using Tmf viewer, I cannot load the image_global.bgl. Searching my disk does not give me any results either. I do have image_global00 etc. but not the global. Somebody/thing apparently robb(y)ed me.
(It is starting to dawn on me that maybe Microsoft was right in firing the whole Aces team as the deeper you delve into the game, the more shortcomings crop up. Might be they were, for commercial reasons, forced into releasing the product too early, before all the bugs were eliminated, the outcome however is the same. And unfortunately no new version is anticipated. But that is only my personal opinion and has nothing to do with this thread).
Guess we have to live with it.

Roby
 
hotelfox said:
Your modification looks like the perfect substitute, Dick! Which tool did you use (I guess SBuilder X)? And, did you touch the water polygon as well (to remove the trees)?
Click to expand...

I did use SBuilderX, and used "LC_Wooded_Tundra" ( it's landclass #63, I believe ). Covering an area with a textured vector poly forces the sim to use that poly's landclass and autogen. In turn, that new autogen uses different object models, that are more 'snug', and more easily excluded by the underlying default autogen exclusion.

Look at the TMFViewer pic above. It shows the size of the poly I used to cover the water and the airport background. It's pretty generous because it needs to cover the landclass #60 autogen refpoints completely with the landclass #63 autogen. This #63's autogen is excluded just fine by the default water and default airport background... so it's just one poly in the BGL.

The problem is the #60 landclass' autogen models... they are 'clumps' of trees and their refpoint is not covered by the default exclusions. They have very large bounding boxes, so overlapping trees show in excluded areas, if the refpoint is not covered by the excluding poly... that's why the exclude, or a new textured poly needs to be oversized.

If you were to identify the AGN files of the #60 textures, you could edit the clumps out with single trees, make new AGN files, and that would permanently solve the problem of oversized bounding boxes for the entire world, concerning LC #60.

The Aces used the clumps to help increase the performance of FSX... as everyone was nagging them to increase performance, and nobody wished to simply turn down their autogen slider. The Aces just gave the endusers what they were crying about... as a result it messed up several airports. I don't think the Aces had ever considered the problem.

Dick
 
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