simpletons texture problem

[jetwelder]

this is embarrasing, its obviously very simple.....in my defence i say some things i know well, and some i dont....

i can uv map, adjust, apply texture.export...no problem....what i cant do is export a sheet of combined objects....its a filename problem....but provided the name of the sheet is the same as the uvw object,and the test texture is applied and named to the object, i can only export one object per texture sheet...as many objects as i like, each with theyre own texture sheet....

ie uvw map, md3,lith, psp, apply tex in gmax,,,tex named to match object...
save,,,,,,,second object,,,same,,,export merged model,,,export two dds files.

named to match, it appears...ican also uvw unwrap and adjust several objects
and build many object tex map,dds export...but it will only paint an object that matches the individual tex name, but none of the others...???

when i apply a tex to a component called fusalage,should i change the name of the tex to match the component...i do...?

when i export my texture sheet as a flipped dds,which contains many objects
each named with the fsx tex named to match...
it will only paint the object the the sheet is named after...i tried lightning_T dds. no luck....i tried fusalage_T dds. no luck...i tried fuselage dds. and fusalage is painted...change to intake dds ,intake is painted...
image shows two objects with 2 texture files....but what really dim mistake stops me from combining tex on one sheet.....oh the answer is going to make me feel really stupid.....jim

 

[jetwelder]

sorry image prob

upload image

 

[Deleted member 1281]

Can't really follow you in all detail but you can and should get oodles of parts mapped by one texture sheet, typically 2048 x 2048. Call your diffuse texture lightning_1.bmp or ...dds (why though since you are apparently using PSP), your specular texture linghtning_1_spec.bmp, and have them set up correctly in the material editor.

Use the fuselage as your master pattern for the primary layout, then use lithunwrap to create a first version of lightrning_1. Add additional parts by going the same route, now using the already created lightning_1 as a background image and moving the part in the Unwrap Editor so as not to overlap with any part or parts already present in lightning_1. Add the new parts to lightning_1 via a new layer set to multiply or lighten mode. Merge. Continue until no further parts fit on lightning_1. If there are more parts continue with lightning_2 as above.

 

[jetwelder]

cant get this right

the images should explain.....i load fuselage and lelevator,relevator...hide elevators....map fuse...apply fsx tex....after md3,lith.

then hide fuse map elevator left,md3, lith, tex....

hide then map final r elevator...tex....unhide all mapped and textured...export model to fsx....merge maps into one, load into psp...flip...export as dds to texture folder in fsx...

it will happily texture that which i name,ie fusalge.or relevator.or l elevator...

when mapping i cant call every object by the same name..

when saving to md3 i cant call every map by the same name

when saving bmap for psp its called fmk6

how do you get many objects on the same texture sheet..not much point in painting bmp in psp for dds export if only one of the objects show up..

ime missing something fundamental...jim..image1. files infsx....image of fusalage sheet called fusalage in sim and painted....all others black....the image in the sim is using the combined texture sheet

 

[Deleted member 1281]

Patience Jim, you'll get there eventually.

jetwelder;141191]the images should explain.....i load fuselage and lelevator,relevator...hide elevators....map fuse...apply fsx tex....after md3,lith.

To begin with, re your pics list, set your browser so as to specify file extensions,without that you cannot work at all (it's a Microsoft default outrage, but can and should be be altered). Also let it give you a "detail" list so we can see the filesizes, too.

(Made for beginners, but actually inviting them to open readme.exe and such.)

Also, let us know which texture dimension you are using.

then hide fuse map elevator left,md3, lith, tex....

hide then map final r elevator...tex....unhide all mapped and textured...export model to fsx....merge maps into one, load into psp...flip...export as dds to texture folder in fsx...
it will happily texture that which i name,ie fusalge.or relevator.or l elevator...

Er, "that which I name?"

when mapping i cant
call every object by the same name..

Of course not.

when saving to md3 i cant call every map by the same name

.md3 isn't a map, it's a model?

when saving bmap for psp its called fmk6

Why is it called that? Better use the filename specified in the Material Editor? Have you got fmk6 specified in the Material Editor? If you haven't then it won't show...

how do you get many objects on the same texture sheet..not much point in painting bmp in psp for dds export if only one of the objects show up..

PSP isn't a bitmap, but otherwise indeed. One of your pics shows that you have several parts mapped onto one sheet. Do the parts display correctly textured when uswing this sheet in gmax? (Check this.) Then they should also show up in FSX ...

ime missing something fundamental...jim..image1. files infsx....image of fusalage sheet called fusalage in sim and painted....all others black....the image in the sim is using the combined texture sheet

Give us a chance to help you by posting your material texture associations, and a detailed file list of what's in your FSX lightning texture folder, possibly with thumbnail version of the texture itself.

 

[jetwelder]

thanks for all that

all my tutorials are for fs9. ime using fsx/acc.....ime not a photographer...so
a recent purchase of paint shop pro, is not entirely understood yet...

you can be certain this is a faulty input device, ie myself...will do what ive been doing, ie over and over again, in slightly different ways, taking notes...

what throwing my thinking process off, is the ease with which i can map multiple objects, but only with theyre own seperate tex sheets, and have them appear in fsx...

the modded tex cfg is installed...i dont think the final export from psp,flipped dds is the prob,using the nvid plugin..

i dont think the md3, or lith is the prob....i think my prob is the mat ed and mat navigator? or whatever its called, and naming and allocating settings..

so back to work...i can model, export, animate,some sounds,lights ,contact points..started studying xml...i build and o/c my own systems...but with this
prob i cant see the wood for the trees...

its like working on an engine for hours, only to discover that its failure to start
is caused by no fuel in the tank....oooops...time for a lunch break,cheers..jim

 

[Deleted member 1281]

Jim, rather than waste endless time, why not simply send your gmax file (or part of it, say fuse and wings, if you are afraid of me pirating it), and I'll promise we'll get at the prob in no time. Also send the FSX dds texture.

[addr removed]

 

[jetwelder]

good idea

this is my first build, so a student.....i have no problem with passing all of my resources for this model to anyone who wants to use it, for whatever purposes....

my main purpose is to learn all i can for my future modelling....i will always be a amatuar, freeware only modeller...but i would like to be a good one...

i would load onto this site, but i dont think cluttering up fs developer with half baked models would be a great idea..

i have never sent an attachment to an e mail....cant be that difficult....

i have an fmk6 within 3 km of where i live,i can climb all over it with a tape measure,and camera any time....photos, drawings,official RAF pilots notes..video..gmax models,parts,etc.......get back to this tonight..time now
14.50 gmt..06.09.10....jim

 

[Deleted member 1281]

OK, but no more than 10MB zipped please, else my mailing prog will complain.

Yes it seems you don't get your different meshes produced by lithunwrap onto one texture sheet. In PSP you can stack them in layers so that they show at once...

 

[hairyspin]

I'd suggest it's not a file name problem, it's that "Export Selected..." problem again, just another twist.

This is not an exhaustive answer, you've made enough progress so far to fill in the blanks yourself.

You're mapping one object in your model without a problem, like a wing (this one's mine):-

or a fuselage:-

and all of these are mapped to the positions I want them on the UV map. But I want to map more than 40 objects on this one UV map!

So map each object to the desired position on the UV map, then select all 40+, Export Selected to .MD3 and open LithUnwrap:-

Look OK? Save the map from LithUnwrap as a bitmap (I'm using the Color&Outline and Fill options, 2048x2048):-

Give this bitmap the name you want, then create an FSX material using this bitmap for your model and apply it to the selected objects.

Finally you can do .DDS conversion of the bitmap, export the model to FSX and see what you've got.

Hope this helps.

 

[jetwelder]

thanks for all this

i will get back wed evening gmt.....in my attempt to fix to many things at once.i managed to export a model without a guid, or at least one that didnt match...causing fsx to crash repeatedly,a reinstall.reseting my controllers...
and re exporting. ime back to where iwas before.....

did i make a back up of my cfg.....er...no so ive got to redo my contact points and lights....

you only learn from your mistakes....boy am i learning a lot....thanks again.jim

 

[Deleted member 1281]

A sidenote on Hairyspin's fine explanation ...

Aren't you missing a step? How do you know where to place part #40 (say, your flaps) without overlapping parts 1-39 (say, your wings) unless you already know where parts 1-39 are located on the sheet? And the same goes for basically all parts from part #2 on, doesn't it? AFAI can see this needs to be a step by step process using a cumulatively populated texture bmp?

I agree however that the final step is as you say it is.

I'd be glad if I am wrong on this; maybe it's me who is missing a crucial twist in the proceedings?

Edit: Wait, I see the light. - You map part One, create the lithunwrap meshmap, use it for the diffuse. You map part 2, Export Selected part 1 and 2, use the map for the diffuse. You map part 3, Export Selected parts 1, 2, and 3, etc etc ... and go on until you have filled the sheet. Right?

A bit slow on the uptake, me. But it's cool. Thanks Hairyspin!

Jetwelder take note. No need even to use PSP except for final dds conversion (and actual texture painting of course).

 

[n4gix]

There are essentially three ways to "fill" the diffuse texture sheet.

1. Export a UVW Mapped part to .md3, load in LithUnwrap, UVW/Save as bitmap, load that bitmap in Photoshop/PSP/GIMP as a new layer. Save As to "diffuse_texture_name.psd" and use that in the GMax Material for the Diffuse Color assigned texture.

Continue this process until the texture sheet is as full as possible...

2. Same as above except...

Also Save the loaded .md3 as a .lum file.

When loading the next .md3, use Merge function to add the new parts to the existing .lum file. Continue "Merging" additional .md3 part files until the sheet is completely filled. After each iteration, UVW/Save as a bitmap, and load the result in your Photoshop file so it can be "seen" by GMax to "see" what areas remain available for more parts.

3. Use the method described above by using Export Selected to a single .md3 file, then load in LithUnwrap and UVW/Save the filled texture bitmap.

I use a combination of all three methods from time to time. Typically I will only use #3 after having previously used #1 and/or #2 during the UVW Mapping session, and then only to generate the final "Master Mesh Template" for the texture sheet.

 

[hairyspin]

You map part One, create the lithunwrap meshmap, use it for the diffuse. You map part 2, Export Selected part 1 and 2, use the map for the diffuse. You map part 3, Export Selected parts 1, 2, and 3, etc etc ... and go on until you have filled the sheet. Right?

Exactly.

Just make sure, after you've successfully added another part or parts to the bitmap, to reload the texture in gmax:-

There's another handy trick while doing this, because it's easy to miss a part when you've got 20 or more to select - Named Selection Sets.

I have a set named Mapped and as I move on to mapping another object, add it to this set. When I'm ready to export to LithUnwrap again, choose Mapped from the drop-down list and everything mapped so far is selected ready to export.

If you don't know what Named Selection Sets are, see n4gix's sticky in the Modeling forum (thanks Bill! )

 

[jetwelder]

all of you must have infinite patience

i am doing something completely stupid, but ime sure its at the early part of the process...

i can save lum,and merge into one map, then into psp,paint and flip dds export.

i can only save individual objects....then merge into one...but fsx sees only one of the objects.....whichever i name the tex map.....

this is definately at the begining in gmax.......i load fusalage, merge in lelevator....hide l elevator....map fuse....unwrap....there it is....see image...

save as uvw, save as md3, save as lum....

back to gmax...unhide,hide fusalage,click on lelevator.....whats on the stack
previously is replaced by lelevator...and now i can map it and it appears in unwrap...i can save it in all the ways possible...

see image.....but following a tutorial where finally you add mesh select, all polys gives me multiple selected...and unwrap doesnt show all the mapped objects...

the only way it works is if i attach the lelevator to the fusalage...but then i cant hide selected...ime giving objects mat ids....it makes no diff if i apply a tex to each object before or after...

ime missing something fundamental......what does group,ungroup do....ime not using it....jim

 

[jetwelder]

this is what i can do

in gmax load fuselage, and merge lelevator....i hide lelevator..and map fuse left,right, mesh select.poly selected by id...etc as per tutorial...i can save, as uvw, md3, lum...and i can continue this process right up to having it appear in fsx....the object is called fuselage, in gmax,in the mat editor i call it fuselage..when saving as a dds to fsx, icall it fuselage....

i can do this for as many objects as i like....but thats the wrong way to do it

each object has its own tex sheet...wrong..

if i merge all these seperate uvw in lith they look fine...if i finally export them
to fsx it doesnt matter what icall the dds file...it will only paint the object i name the file after,fuselage,lelevator,....if the dds is called fuselage, the fuselage is painted, and nothing else..if its called lwing, only the left wing is painted and nothing else....

so its in gmax uvw where my problem lies....not renaming textures in gmax and leaving them as default makes no difference....

to map a number of objects onto one uvw can only be done if all the objects are attached,cant be hidden, and are all called the same name....

so i keep trying two simple objects.....following bill leamings crib sheet....

load fuselage,merge lelevator,hide lelevator....map upto mesh select all polys
unwrap....theres my fuselage.....this is the point where the problem lies,i just dont know what it is.....i want now to map my hidden lelevator ont the same
uvw along with the fuselage...so i can save to md3......

collapse the stack, tried it both ways...when i hide fuse the stack dissapears.
not a surprise,,,click on lelevator...it becomes a new object to map....same procedure......according to tutorial....final is mesh select, all polys, uvw unwrap....with both objects selected....i see the last one i mapped....but not the previous ones...i think this is probably correct....but how to map two objects in gmax, and see them in the unwrap window..

or single objects merged in lith,,,sent to fsx, that must be on the sheet,,or changing the name of the sheet wouldnt cause the named object to be painted.....

its got to be a naming problem....or the gap in gmax between 2 objects and my understanding, of the uvw....uvw unwrap.....i gave the fuse mat id 1 and 2....i gave the lelevator 3 4 and 5.....ive got tutorials, but even following them to the letter, it doesnt work....its me . ime missing something...jim....ive also added the tex to each obj before moving to the next in uvw.....i will try as many different approaches tomorrow as i can think of....maybe bypass lith.... with screenshots....maybe not........i can map a single object. and it appears in fsx.......what are the extra steps for mapping two..

 

[Deleted member 1281]

Too many mistakes in your latest report, Jim, no use even to point them out in detail.

Again, it's easier to leave a copy of your gmax file on a server for us to point you in the right direction. It's only a matter of 5 minutes or so to modify a gmax file so that you can see how it's supposed to work, and from then on you can simply follow the procedure outlined by Hairyspin or Bill in this thread.

 

[n4gix]

From what I can decipher from your message(s), you are making a very fundamental mistake...

DO NOT EVER RENAME YOUR TEXTURE ONCE ASSIGNED TO THE MATERIAL!!!

Since you are changing the filename, you are running around in a circle like a head with its chicken cut off... Er, that's backwards, but the principle's the same!

It really is just this simple:

Create a blank image in Photoshop (or PSP). Save As some filename, such as MyFuselage.psd.

In GMax create a new Material, load MyFuselage.psd into the Diffuse Color slot of the material.

Select your objects in GMax which will be assigned to this Material, then click on the "Apply" button in the Material Editor.

Now, leave well enough alone!

Proceed to UVW Map your object(s), Edit the maps in the UVW Editor, export to .md3, export a mesh image, load that mesh image in Photoshop (or PSP) as a new layer, then save as a new .psd file using the same name!

Back in GMax, open the Material Editor and use the "RELOAD" button to refresh the image in GMax if necessary.

Continue your UVW Mapping until done.

 

[jetwelder]

i dont know what to say

thank you seems a small word,,,well two words..

within the last 10 minutes, ive managed to map just my fusalage, and lelevator to one texture map..export and see them in fsx....thats two objects
on one tex sheet...

sure its a mess...but ime only trying to test the procedure....for an idiot, i have one saving grace....bloody minded stubborness...

theres a lot more to uvw mapping, textures,materials, maps, than just being able to map an object in fsx...

its going to take,days,months,years..to master....tomorrow ime going to play
with my 1957 triumph motorcycle...give my poor brain a rest.....

thanks again....jim

 

[n4gix]

Three more words: you're welcome...

We've all got our scars from having gone through the same learning process, so don't feel like you're alone in suffering...