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Xwind and TNG

robystar

robystar

Messages
5,214
Xwind leg and TNG

Hi,

I was wondering whether it is possible to influence the length of the cross wind leg of a particular airplane doing TNG's. I understand it is data in the aircraft model, cfg and air file that determine the length of the downwind leg but I cannot find any info on influencing cross wind leg length.
Fyi, in my case I am speaking about a VFR TNG flightplan only involving one airport, where I set a left runway pattern altitude at 0 ft AGL and where I would like to have the plane make the same low but wider circuit than it does now.
I do not think it can be done, but, just maybe, I am wrong?
 
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robystar said:
Hi,

I was wondering whether it is possible to influence the length of the cross wind leg of a particular airplane doing TNG's. I understand it is data in the aircraft model, cfg and air file that determine the length of the downwind leg but I cannot find any info on influencing cross wind leg length.
Fyi, in my case I am speaking about a VFR TNG flightplan only involving one airport, where I set a left runway pattern altitude at 0 ft AGL and where I would like to have the plane make the same low but wider circuit than it does now.
I do not think it can be done, but, just maybe, I am wrong?
Click to expand...

The size airplane influences the altitude, downwind leg distance from the runway and the length of the downwind. A Cessna172 will fly a TNG pattern very close and tight using the 1000 ft altitude. A turbo prop or small jet will fly about 1500 ft and the pattern is much larger.

FS only allows 3 VFR TNG's in the pattern at one time. If you add a 4th plane the runway gets lockdown when the TNG is abeam the runway threshold. there is not enough time in between the 3 TNG's for the 4th to take the active runway.

If the TNG is IFR then you can have many more TNG's but it is not a true TNG. TNG is a training flight for VFR aircraft. Any IFR type TNG does not do a TNG but does a missed approach go around. This is called hood work in real world when Pilot's are working on their Instrument rating so FS uses the same type coding.
 
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Thanks again for the umptieth time.

Re
"The size airplane influences the altitude, downwind leg distance from the runway and the length of the downwind. A Cessna172 will fly a TNG pattern very close and tight using the 1000 ft altitude. A turbo prop or small jet will fly about 1500 ft and the pattern is much larger.":
I noticed that. So it is the radius of the pattern that changes and not only the downward leg, If I understand it right.
Re
"FS only allows 3 VFR TNG's in the pattern at one time. If you add a 4th plane the runway gets lockdown when the TNG is abeam the runway threshold. there is not enough time in between the 3 TNG's for the 4th to take the active runway." :
yes, I experienced that as well. But the last plane makes a kind of missed approach and Traffic tools informs it is going around but it continues straight on, higher and higher without ever turning back. But I guess that is because it is lacking further instructions from the unicom airport.
Re IFR TNG: will find out what kind of trouble I will get into with that kind.

Rob
 
Yes, the radius gets a little larger because the AI Planes turn rate, greater speed vs ground coverage the larger the plane becomes.

In some cases the AI Plane will not get the last ATC instruction do to other ATC instructions in the .dll list. When the AI Plane misses the ATC.dll instruction it flys off into the wild blue younder. Even though this is a Unicom airport there is still ATC.dll/AI_Player.dll interaction without sound commands.

IFR FP's set to TNG do not use the runway left/right pattern or pattern altitude. You must set the altitude in the FP and make it higher then the surrounding terrain (based on which way you set the turn).

The left/right TNG (missed approach) turn is in ADE Approach Mode if any type approach exist.
 
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I am still in the VFR phase if you do not mind. For the moment I think there is a better chance of flying low and use the runway pattern altitude to clear surrounding mountains.
I do however still have some questions, even after having read ( a couple of times) your contribution to the TNG's thread in the AIFP forum.
To make it a bit more comprehensible, I attach a GE screenshot.
FYI, the FP is quite simple:
AC#6139,APNL5,1%,4Hr,VFR
(1) 00:29,TNG01:17,56,F,6,OAT4
(2) 01:21,01:40,58,F,6,OAT5
(3) 02:05,02:33,65,F,6,OAT3
and
OAT3 is a heli overlay with a right primary runway pattern.
OAT4 is in fact nothing more than a waypoint with a right pattern and pattern alt at 1500ft to avoid flying into the mountain side.
OAT5 is a normal small airport (yellow pin in the upper righthand corner of the screenshot)
Aircraft tested: default Bell, C172 and an AI AH64.
They all make a rather complicated pattern in accordance with the path I drew in GE.
Questions:
-How come they make such a pattern (making a circuit over OAT3 and then pass OAT4 and come back) and not a more obvious one?
-After their 1st TNG in OAT4 they always make a right turn although I understood the runway pattern only influences approaches?
- suppose I make it an IFR flightplan, how would I influence the direction after take off and/or after the missed approach at OAT4?
- Can't AI make a 'fly straight in' ?
I promise I will not hold it against you if you are fed up with my questions (and if I ever finish my work, it goes without saying and out of principle,that it is freeware mentioning my name as beta tester for your work):).

Rob
 
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