Creating islands for FSX

[Jack Kelly]

I can't seem to make a proper small island for FSX using ADE terrain polys. I've tried many combinations of flattens, land classes, and excludes. The water is always there! Any suggestions, anyone??

 

[robystar]

You have to exclude the water first (exclude specific and specify the type of water that is there). Mind you, you will be excluding a whole qmid (11, I believe though not sure I remember correctly) of water.

 

[Jack Kelly]

Thanks for your quick response to my question. I did try that exclude, but it doesn't exactly make a small island. Any more ideas, anyone?

 

[meows]

Any more ideas, anyone?:

Actually yes. After a few years of trial and error, I did get some great islands.

U have to start with

1. Type, Tag Name, Alt. Feet, Lock, Comments
   Exclude Specific,Hydro Polygons Generic Ocean Perennial,0.00,None,
   Road,Asphalt 6 Lanes Divided Median,-,None,
   Road,Concrete 4 Lanes Divided Median,-,None,
   Airport Background,Flatten,4.00,None,
   Land Class,Airfield1,0.00,None,
   Airport Background,Flatten,4.00,None,4
   Airport Background,Flatten,4.00,None,4
   Airport Background,Flatten,4.00,None,
   Water,Ocean Perennial,0.00,None,lake1
   Water,Ocean Perennial,0.00,None,lake2
   Water,Ocean Perennial,0.00,None,lake3
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,lake shore test
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,ocean shore
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Land Class,Small City Suburban Non Grid Wet,0.00,None,city1
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Land Class,Tropical Degraded Forest,0.00,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Land Class,Small City Suburban Non Grid Wet,0.00,None,
   Land Class,Tropical Rainforest,0.00,None,
   Land Class,Tropical Rainforest,0.00,None,
   Road,Asphalt 2 Lanes Undivided Median,-,None,
   Road,Asphalt 2 Lanes Divided Median,-,None,
   Water,Ocean Perennial,0.00,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Shoreline,Ocean,-,None,
   Airport Background,Flatten,3.00,None,
   Airport Background,Flatten,3.00,None,
   Road,Asphalt 2 Lanes Divided Median,-,None,
   Airport Background,Flatten,4.00,None,
   Airport Background,Flatten,6.00,None,
   Airport Background,Exclude AutoGen,6.00,None,
   Airport Background,Exclude AutoGen,6.00,None,

The list is Terrian Polygon's
I would suggest starting at 0 to 3 feet when you set up a new island.. Now
you use the Exclude Specific,Hydro Polygons Generic Ocean Perennial,0.00 and this
wipes out the ocean..
Now with clean ground.. add your islands,, I did once have a 8000 foot island, they are tricky to get right and look real.. up to around a 3000 foot island with tidalpools, lakes, reefs. docks and the kitchen sink are possible.

A tip ::: to get the really cool coastal reef water that is that light light blue with tints.. use Xbuilder.
LIKE SO

 

[hotelfox]

Hi Jack,
ADE is a perfect tool. For building islands however I prefer SBuilderX. It' s pretty easy to learn. I would give it a try.

 

[FlyingAxx]

I second that. That's a combination of ADE and SbuiderX:

The island is shaped with SbuiderX, the airport and objects had been done with ADE, the autogen with annotator.exe (MS SDK).

 

[hotelfox]

Looks great, Axel!

 

[JRobinson]

I'll third that sentiment - and show off a little myself

These are islands near Acadia Nat'l park in Maine, USA, I clicked out something like 9 QMID 11 cells so far replacing hydro polys and shorelines. I made these photoreal water overlays, the blend mask lets the new more accurate landclass islands show through which saves a ton of autogen annotation.

This first shot is from P3D2 and I was playing with a Shade preset with HDR on and the whole 9 yards:

This one is from FSX of the same area from a slightly different angle:

 

[Jack Kelly]

I finally got what I was looking for. This is my depiction of Hrolfssker in northern Iceland.
You guys are awesome!! Just knowing that it could be done gave me the confidence to keep trying. The ADE procedure, as I uderstand it, is to Exclude specific the type of water, build up your island using a flatten, then put back a different type of water in two polys, fitting each carefully around half of the island. This is fairly easy if you're way out at sea, but a bit more difficult if the exclude reaches shoreline. Perhaps the shoreline vertices should be marked with temporary objects to make it easier to restore.
I need small islands because I'm trying to enhance Iceland by adding lighthouses. They are great landmarks for small planes flying VFR into the many airports and airfields that dot the coast. However many of the lighthouses are on small islands that are not in FSX.

Thanks again for all your responses. One more question -- what is the difference between perennial and non-perennial water? I haven't noticed any differences so far.


Attached is my depiction of Hrolfssker in northern Iceland.

 

[hotelfox]

Perfect job, Jack! That' sexactly the way you can do it using ADE.

@ JRobinson: gorgeous looking stuff! And after taking a look at that area in GE, it seems to me there' s still some work left for you !

 

[FlyingAxx]

I'll third that sentiment - and show off a little myself

These are islands near Acadia Nat'l park in Maine, USA, I clicked out something like 9 QMID 11 cells so far replacing hydro polys and shorelines. I made these photoreal water overlays, the blend mask lets the new more accurate landclass islands show through which saves a ton of autogen annotation.

Great stuff! However, I wanted coconuts and so I've had to plant them myself...
I think your way is indeed usually the best that can be done as you don't have to care for seasonal effects, too. Thanks for sharing.

<snip>
Thanks again for all your responses. One more question -- what is the difference between perennial and non-perennial water? I haven't noticed any differences so far.
<snip>.

Jack, it seems that there is just one difference and I'm wondering that you didn't notice it . Non-perennial water doesn't show up (at least for me). According to the description you could find in the SDK the non-perennial effects should show seasonal influences (per definition). Even if I'm no Guru at all, as far as I know Microsoft never coupled any actions with such water polygons (I was hoping for tidal effects of appearing and disappearing water). If you ever want to see water somewhere you better should use the perennial type.

BTW, your work on Island looks great. I love details like the landing zone at the beach and the path towards the lighthouse...

 

[Jack Kelly]

Thank you all for your help with my question. Your knowledge is impressive. I SHOULD have noticed the difference between perennial & non-perennial water, Axel! I suppose I'm always operating in some degree of confusion. I have downloaded and installed SBuilderX, and will try it out as time allows. Thanks for the suggestion.

 

[hotelfox]

Let me know if you need help. The start might appear be a bit tricky.

 

[robystar]

Correct me if I am wrong but maybe you would need to add some mesh as well? Or is this island that flat?
You could do that with ADE as well since it is a fictitious island (I imagine?).
And do not forget to add the shorelines again.

 

[Jack Kelly]

How do I add mesh? I've never seen any reference to that in ADE, but I'd love to try. Can you give me a kick start in the right direction?

 

[scruffyduck]

Sorry - you can't add mesh with ADE. You can create sloped polygons to re-define a specific area. SBuilderX is probably the best bet for Mesh but it is not my area so I am sure someone will put us right

 

[gadgets]

Unless the actual terrain is very uneven, sloping polys (it's still called a flatten) are the simplest way to add some height to such a small area.

Don

 

[hotelfox]

2 things with regard to mesh in FSX:

Planet earth as microsoft created it for FSX was a dry ball first showing the mesh which you will experience when flying in default FSX. 'Aces' then spread water where it shold be. Unfortunately that job was done quite generously here and there. Some coastlines match with reality, others are unprecise to such an extend that you might even fail to recognize a certain island.
Talking about islands - some islands accidentally were covered with water entirely. One example is the island 'Dia', north of LGIR. The island completely vanished as water in FSX usually irons the mesh underneath.

Yes, the mesh is there! I wanted to see 'Dia' when taking off from LGIR. This is how the result looks in SBX:



I just excluded the water and carefully drew the coastline following the background image in SBX. And this is the island in default FSX:



My work became part of Emilios' (FSDG) wonderful LGIR scenery.

Lifting smaller islands from the ground of the ocean might result in dry land without any mesh showing up. SBX offers a nice vector poly though which allows you to create mesh called 'Legacy_LWM_Land _Flatten'.



You can assign an individual altitude to each point.



Good luck and have fun!

 

[FlyingAxx]

2 things with regard to mesh in FSX:
<snip>
SBX offers a nice vector poly though which allows you to create mesh called 'Legacy_LWM_Land _Flatten'.
<....>
You can assign an individual altitude to each point.
<snip>

Just a question: Isn't it pretty much the same functionality as being provided by ADEX in the properties of flatten polygons, making available a checkbox to "edit each individual point" (as being mentioned already by Don)?

 

[JRobinson]

It pretty much is exactly the same thing but SbuilderX doesn't need an airport nearby and you can do some advanced stuff with your polys like:

fill to QMID 11
slice to QMID 11 (or whichever QMID level you're working with at the time)
make line (where a line is made from the perimeter of a polygon - this becomes your perfectly matched shoreline effortlessly).
set as hole (you make a hydro poly that encompases a QMID 11, make another poly that represents the island and set it as a hole in the larger poly)
convert to poly (a line 100m wide and 500m long can become a poly 100m wide and 500m long)


I would personally use AB_Flatten for sloped polys rather that Legacy_LWM_Land _Flatten. I once needed a road grade reconstructed that was built after the mesh data was sourced. I made a line 75m wide with a vertex every 100m or so. I subtracted the lowest elevation from the highest and divided by the number of vertices, then I adjusted each vertex to the height of the previous one plus the calculated value so the line made a perfectly gradual slope as it wound it's way up through the canyon. I converted the line to a polygon and set it as AB_Flatten, the elevations from the points in the line remained intact. I spent a lot of time making other sloped polys to blend it in with the surrounding mesh but the result came out quite nice I thought: