Is Win10 The Cause?

#1
I have decided that Win10 is the cause of the numerous problems that arise in Flight Sim these days. It's unannounced updates and tweaks are somehow (no real proof of course) the root cause of my scenery woes. . .problems I've never had before with processes I've used hundreds of times to produce scenery for FSX and P3D over a 10 year span.

The latest is a simple satellite image ground texture (no water within 20 miles by the way) that after compiling a simple blend refuses to show in the Sim (FSX). . .however I can put the one I did 5 years ago back in and it displays perfectly. I have replaced the "resample" program I have been using in my work folder thinking that possibly it had become corrupt somehow. However after a compile this morning it still will not display so I put my old imagery back in and voila'. . .pretty as you please.

It's almost enough to drive a sane person to X-Plane!!
 
#3
lol, so your inference is that it's actually that I don't know what I'm doing then? I would still refer to the fact that this isn't Rocket Science (a simple 2 Source compile). . .it's something I've done too many times to count. So why now. . .and why does one work and the other not?
 
#4
Funny enough, I made the jump to Win10 as soon as it was offered.... I found myself re-installing Windows 7 within a week. Windows 10, to me just looks like it was never meant to run on a desktop PC - software now called apps etc. I ran into problems with every software I use to create my scenery, 3ds max had problems, photoshop had problems, SBX had problems... and yes I put it all down to windows 10 as I get none of those issues on windows 7.

I personally despise Windows 10 and everything about it and think it should only be available on smartphones and tablets!
 
#6
https://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/is-win10-the-cause.443714/post-806986

I have decided that Win10 is the cause of the numerous problems that arise in Flight Sim these days. It's unannounced updates and tweaks are somehow (no real proof of course) the root cause of my scenery woes. . .problems I've never had before with processes I've used hundreds of times to produce scenery for FSX and P3D over a 10 year span.

The latest is a simple satellite image ground texture (no water within 20 miles by the way) that after compiling a simple blend refuses to show in the Sim (FSX). . .however I can put the one I did 5 years ago back in and it displays perfectly. I have replaced the "resample" program I have been using in my work folder thinking that possibly it had become corrupt somehow. However after a compile this morning it still will not display so I put my old imagery back in and voila'. . .pretty as you please.

It's almost enough to drive a sane person to X-Plane!!
Hi Ed:

Win-7 is IMHO a good Windows version to use.

FYI: I purposely do not use any MS Windows version until at least 4 years after release, and I still do not use Win-10.

But I do believe the vast majority of FS developers and FS end users are not having issues with Win-10 when running SDK Resample or when displaying Resample-compiled imagery BGLs.


IIUC, SBuilderX 3.15 (64-Bit) has resolved all issues previously reported specifically involving Win-10 ...in SBuilderX version 3.14 (64-bit).

AFAIK, SDK utilities should all be working properly under Win-10.


We may be able to help resolve work-flow / procedural issues if you post a *.INF file for your project in question. ;-)


I might occasionally ask you to "explain" yourself, but I'm not so sure I would ever ask you to "X-Plane" yourself. :-D

GaryGB
 
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#7
[Source]
Type=MultiSource
NumberOfSources=2

[Source1]
Type = BMP
Layer = Imagery
SourceDir = "."
SourceFile = "White_Birch.BMP"
Variation = All
NullValue = 255,255,255
SamplingMethod = Gaussian
ulyMap = 33.1404259948224
ulxMap = -97.0216369628906
xDim = 2.68220901489258E-06
yDim = 2.24611599031008E-06
Channel_BlendMask = 2.0

[Source2]
Type = TIFF
Layer = None
SourceDir = "."
SourceFile = "White_Birch_B.TIF"
SamplingMethod = Gaussian
ulyMap = 33.1404259948224
ulxMap = -97.0216369628906
xDim = 2.68220901489258E-06
yDim = 2.24611599031008E-06

[Destination]
DestDir = "C:\FlightSim_Scenery_Folders\EastCoast_Airports\NY_STATE_AIRPORTS\White Birch Airfield\scenery"
DestBaseFileName = "Photo01"
DestFileType = BGL
LOD = Auto
UseSourceDimensions = 1
CompressionQuality = 85

**********************************************************************************************************************************************
The resulting bgl size is 128, 228kb
**********************************************************************************************************************************************

Very straight forward:

Base image is 117 Meg
Image size is 4864x8448

Blend is grayscale 8bit/256
 
#8
Hi Ed:

Would you post a screenshot and description of the objectionable graphical issues being displayed- or not being displayed- in FS at run time ? :scratchch

GaryGB

PS: Please also tell us what what graphics application was used to create the 8-Bit 256-step gray-scale Blend Mask TIFF file.
 
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#9
No Problem:

First Image is of the two main characters. . .on the left the captured satellite image. . .on the right the 8bit/256 grayscale Blend.



Next image is the current "Photo01" image compiled 5 years ago for the original release and placed in the sim.



Final image (or lack thereof) is the result of the compiled done yesterday and placed in the Sim.

 

rhumbaflappy

Moderator
Staff member
Resource contributor
#11
I'd look in at the photoreal in TMFViewer, and note which LODs are actually being compiled. The line "LOD = Auto " is often times the cause of problems.

Also, zipping the source files and INF and placing them on Google Drive or One Drive, would allow anyone interested to examine and compile the originals as a test on their machine. (I also find it unlikely Windows 10 is the culprit.)
 
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#12
I deleted everything related to that job and started over. I captured a slightly larger area for the ground texture, and compiled. That one showed perfectly in the Sim. Then I did some color correction, compiled. . .still good. Finally I did a blend, compiled and at first it didn't show that the blend had worked (still showed the hard edges of the original image). What I found though was that even though I had indicated the correct path to the airports scenery folder for the project, once the compile was done it just dumped it in the SBX/Work folder. . .not in the airports scenery folder. I swapped out the photo01 files and everything seems fine now.

All this was done by SBX, letting it do all the compiling rather than doing it manually.
 
#13
I'd look in at the photoreal in TMFViewer, and note which LODs are actually being compiled.
I use the Viewer to check land class in areas I'm working so I know what vegetation is used, but have no idea how to locate the photoreal using the viewer.
 

rhumbaflappy

Moderator
Staff member
Resource contributor
#14
Drag'n'drop the BGL onto TMFViewer, then use the menu item View|Level of Detail to see the actual LODs used in the BGL.
 
#15
https://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/is-win10-the-cause.443714/post-807009

[Source]
Type=MultiSource
NumberOfSources=2

[Source1]
Type = BMP
Layer = Imagery
SourceDir = "."
SourceFile = "White_Birch.BMP"
Variation = All
NullValue = 255,255,255
SamplingMethod = Gaussian

ulyMap = 33.1404259948224
ulxMap = -97.0216369628906
xDim = 2.68220901489258E-06

yDim = 2.24611599031008E-06
Channel_BlendMask = 2.0

[Source2]
Type = TIFF
Layer = None
SourceDir = "."
SourceFile = "White_Birch_B.TIF"
SamplingMethod = Gaussian
ulyMap = 33.1404259948224
ulxMap = -97.0216369628906
xDim = 2.68220901489258E-06

yDim = 2.24611599031008E-06

[Destination]
DestDir = "C:\FlightSim_Scenery_Folders\EastCoast_Airports\NY_STATE_AIRPORTS\White Birch Airfield\scenery"
DestBaseFileName = "Photo01"
DestFileType = BGL
LOD = Auto
UseSourceDimensions = 1
CompressionQuality = 85

**********************************************************************************************************************************************
The resulting bgl size is 128, 228kb
**********************************************************************************************************************************************

Very straight forward:

Base image is 117 Meg
Image size is 4864x8448

Blend is grayscale 8bit/256
Hi Ed:

The *.INF posted above contains Geographic Lat-Lon coordinates of: 33.1404259948224,-97.0216369628906

If you check these coordinates in Google Earth (Desktop Edition) or Google Maps (online), you will see that these coordinates are located near a Lake Dallas TX pier adjacent to the "Montserrat Jesuit Retreat House" just NW of ICAO 30F LakeView airport discussed in your other recent threads here:

https://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/sloped-ramp-for-amphibians.443679/

https://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/sbx-will-not-compile.443681/


IIUC, this may be simply a result of an occasional editing error we might all incur now and then via the "Perils of Copy-and-Paste", wherein we may accidentally overlook editing a portion of what was copied / pasted from an existing source. ;)


As far as what IIUC was the intended target destination airport, I find that although White Birch Airfield now has a new ICAO:

https://web.archive.org/web/20060116012752/http://www.airnav.com/airport/4N8

http://www.airnav.com/airport/nk68


...its Geographic Lat-Lon coordinates are actually : 42.0514200,-75.3166000
 
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#16
BTW, Ed:

Technically, one need not include SamplingMethod = Gaussian in a [Source#] where:

* Layer = Imagery

...and:

* Variation= [ DAY / NIGHT / All ]


...as IIRC, it is ignored by Resample for "visual" type ex: DAY / NIGHT / All imagery, and is only used in other Resample functions such as with Masks where Layer=None and pixels are instead used as a 'data value' source for implementing transparency


Another possible confounding issue which could have otherwise applied here, is the concurrent use of NullValue = 255,255,255 in the same Multisource *.INF which also utilizes Masks in your example above.

You may wish to review Luis Feliz-Tirado's admonitions regarding Null Value and Blend Mask ...in:

Make photo-real ground textures


File Description:
It is very easy to create your very own high-resolution, custom (photo-real) ground textures. This document explains the concepts and techniques and illustrates the use of SBuilderX with which you can quickly and easily download aerial images and make this type of scenery. So, why hesitate? Make Flight Simulator scenery as real as it gets! Very sorry - no support of any kind is offered. Please do not write. For any questions, please post in the Avsim Scenery Design Forum.

Filename: make_photo-real_ground_textures_in_fs_x.zip
License: Freeware
Added: 21st November 2009, 23:20:06
Downloads: 17714
Author: Luis Feliz-Tirado
Size: 2143kb

https://library.avsim.net/esearch.php?CatID=fsxsd&DLID=140539


The MSFS SDK docs on such matters ...are here:

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/previous-versions/microsoft-esp/cc707102(v=msdn.10)#the-resample-tool



https://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/threads/is-win10-the-cause.443714/post-807049

I'd look in at the photoreal in TMFViewer, and note which LODs are actually being compiled. The line "LOD = Auto " is often times the cause of problems.
PS: IIUC, what Dick alluded to above is when a custom photo-real imagery BGL does not utilize sources that are at least LOD-13 (QMID-15 or approximately Zoom Level 15 or higher, in FS at run time, one may have underlying default Land Class textures displayed instead of one's own custom imagery textures.

This can happen when "LOD = Auto" is utilized in a *.INF file with such lower resolution sources ...rather than "LOD = Auto,13", which would otherwise force SDK Resample to still output imagery tiles that could be displayed to prevent FS from falling back to display of default Land Class textures (...which are 1.2 Meters / Pixel or LOD 15 / QMID-17).


FYI: While it may be convenient to keep working source data set sizes smaller, and to save up to 40% on file size for SDK Resample BGL output by using CompressionQuality = 85, if you have an airport with excellent imagery and you want to show it at full detail, you can edit the default value used by SBuilderX in the *.INF file to:

CompressionQuality = 100


Note as well that editing SBuilderX.ini can make ex: "100" the new default 'CompressionQuality' value output to *.INF files:

[Tiles]
ActiveTileFolder=ArcGisImagery
ReprojectMercatorTiles=True
SummerVariations=July,August,September
SpringVariations=April,May,June
FallVariations=October,November
WinterVariations=December,February,March
HardWinterVariations=January
CompressionQuality=100


Hope this helps ! :)

GaryGB
 
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#17
I will begin this round of questions with an apology:
I have not slept well for almost a month now, getting 3 to 4 hours each night at the most. I have gotten overly tired and laxed in what I'm doing to the point that I'm mixing several projects together and getting lost in what's what, (GaryGB you made mention of this in an earlier post when you noted that the coordinates did not match the location I was working on). My temperament has been edgy to say the least and my grumblings concerning this and other projects has no place here where George and Gary and others have been trying assist me. I apologize for the outbursts and I certainly appreciate the help. . .any help that folks here can give.

Update: The second half of this post was originally to ask for help in getting a night texture to show up. That was again my fault. . .because after searching and backtracking I found that once again, even though the "save bgl to" path was correct in the properties box, SBX simply ignores that and dumps it in the work folder. So while I'm looking where I thought it should be and assuming it didn't work, the actual bgl file was sitting somewhere else. I am going to take a hiatus from scenery work for awhile and just enjoy flying as it's obvious to me that my mind is not in the game right now.

4N8_Night_lighting.jpg
 
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#18
Hi Ed:

Been there / done that ...now and then. ;)

I like the look of what you have done with the new 4N8 so far; I recall landing there on a cross-country multi-player fight years ago using your 2013 version from SOH, and I liked then too. :cool:

Feel free to send me a PM with a link to a current 4N8 Beta here- or at SOH- if I might be of some more help.

Happy Flying ! :)

GaryGB
 
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