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FS2004 aircraft mdl export

Hi Tom,

There is nothing I can do about that. To set the correct material attributes MCX has to be able to find the texture, so that it can check if there is an alpha channel or not. Without having a texture MCX can not automatically set the right properties for a transparent texture.
In GMAX all textures that are not reflective can be transparent. Opaque textures just have white alpha channels.
Does the FSX model have any material settings that indicate there is a reflection and no transparency that I am missing on import? At this moment I don't see a way to manually detect this, as it seems there is no specular texture set for FSX. Or is the blend environment by inverse diffuse alpha setting set on the material maybe?
That is what I’ve always seen used for reflection in FSX aircraft. Certainly if that setting is true it means the texture is reflective, and so should have a specular texture added when converted to FS9, I would think.
Is that controlled by the lightmap? Or is this the same symthom as you described in 1. above? E.g. does the alpha come from the diffuse texture?
The alpha in this case definitely comes from the LightMap texture, the diffuse alpha has a completely different pattern. In FS9 the diffuse texture alpha is used for transparency or reflection. The LightMap alpha determines what controls the UserControlled aspect of the lighting. White alpha = controlled by the landing light switch. Black alpha = controlled by the panel lights switch. Of course if you turn on the lights using the L key both will turn on. The ice light on the 440 (on the nacelle) and the DC-6 (on the upper fuselage) is controlled by the landing lights switch, as is the landing light splash on the wing underside in the DC-6. All have a white alpha in those areas. The cabin windows are controlled by the panel lights switch, and thus have a black alpha in that area. It is that area around the cabin windows that turns transparent at night without a Specular Texture.

But the fix for transparent metal and transparent cabin window areas is the same, a specular texture, even if the pattern of transparency is very different.
But how should MCX know it is supposed to be reflective? There needs to be some material setting for that then.
See above, I would use the FSX environment setting.
 
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Hi Tom,
That is what I’ve always seen used for reflection in FSX aircraft. Certainly if that setting is true it means the texture is reflective, and so should have a specular texture added when converted to FS9, I would think.
I have modified the FS2004 MDL writer so that it will automatically add the diffuse texture as specular texture when this option is enabled. It will be in the next development release.
The alpha in this case definitely comes from the LightMap texture, the diffuse alpha has a completely different pattern. In FS9 the diffuse texture alpha is used for transparency or reflection. The LightMap alpha determines what controls the UserControlled aspect of the lighting. White alpha = controlled by the landing light switch. Black alpha = controlled by the panel lights switch. Of course if you turn on the lights using the L key both will turn on. The ice light on the 440 (on the nacelle) and the DC-6 (on the upper fuselage) is controlled by the landing lights switch, as is the landing light splash on the wing underside in the DC-6. All have a white alpha in those areas. The cabin windows are controlled by the panel lights switch, and thus have a black alpha in that area. It is that area around the cabin windows that turns transparent at night without a Specular Texture.
Not sure what is going on with the lightmap, I guess I need to look into that in more detail. As far as I know I export it correctly now in the X file, but I have probably missed something.
 
You might be exporting correctly, I’m not sure. As long as the specular texture is specified it won’t matter with reflective textures. I haven’t checked the LightMap effects on a non-reflective texture, but I can do that with the DC-6 interior.

EDIT: The DC-6 interior works fine.
 
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Now testing with the DC-6B CB-16 model.

FSX DC-6B to FS9 DC-6B:
1. The landing gear is invisible behind the blurred props. The slow props are fine. Part order? The blurred props are at the very end of the Hierarchy.
2. The custom visibility tags I created in the FSX ModelDef file have not been carried over into the FS9 model, and they do not work. The parts show None for the Visibility Condition in the Hierarchy Editor. For example, the chocks never disappear when the engines start. I do have FS9 versions in my makemodel.parts.xml file, but I don't think you read that? My XML file is also renamed mkmodel.parts.xml, since I use MDL Commander and Middleman to export from GMAX. If I Import the converted FS9 model, add the visibility tags in the Hierarchy Editor, and Export as an FS9 model the visibility tags are lost again.
3. One time the Emissive Mode in the FS9 converted aircraft was set to Blend for most materials, which lead to transparency at night in the areas with a black LightMap alpha channel. Changing this to AdditiveNightOnlyUserControlled fixed this. The other times it was set to Additive, which seems to work fine. Perhaps that is enough for FS9 - the other variants of the Additive blend might be ignored?
4. The glass texture has a specular texture and thus is not transparent. Removing it fixes this problem.
5. Prop blades of props 1-3 (engines 2,3, and 4) only twist halfway. Prop blade rotation is OK (see below).
6. In the Material Editor the stairs_t.bmp texture is displayed as a plain gray square. It is displayed properly in the main aircraft display. It is a 256 x 256 BMP with 256 colors. This is also true in all cases below and in the original models (they are all identical textures).
7. The plane has no landing lights, the Attached Objects Editor is empty. The original FSX model has them. The converted CV-440s are also missing landing and taxi lights.

FS9 DC-6B to FS9 DC-6B:
1. The landing gear is visible behind the blurred props, so OK.
2. The custom visibility tags have been converted to CUSTOM visibility tags and work fine.
3. In the Material Editor the Emissive Mode is set to Additive, but that seems to work fine. Perhaps that is enough for FS9 - the other variants of the Additive blend might be ignored?
4. The prop rotation animations have issues. On the right side one (engine #3) or two (engine #4) blades on each prop do not animate properly, they rotate around the engine in an odd way.
5. Prop blades of props 1-3 (engines 2,3, and 4) only twist halfway.
6. The plane has no landing lights, the Attached Objects Editor is empty. The original FS9 model has them.

FS9 DC-6B to FSX DC-6B:
1. The landing gear is visible behind the blurred props, so OK.
2. The custom visibility tags have been converted to CUSTOM visibility tags and work fine.
3. Prop rotation and prop blade twist animations are OK.
4. The Emissive Mode is set to Additive, which causes the lights to be on during the day and not controllable. Changing this to AdditiveNightOnlyUserControlled fixes this, although I much prefer MultiplyBlendUserControlled for lighting in FSX.
5. The landing lights have been converted to generic light attachments using the effect fx_light64635A, and thus do not display. The FSX CV-440 conversion is the same, the landing and taxi lights have been changed and do not work.
6. On one Export the animated parts ended up moved to the center of the plane. The Export-Import-Export technique done a couple of times fixed it.

Hope this helps,
 
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Thanks for the detailed testing again.
1. The landing gear is invisible behind the blurred props. The slow props are fine. Part order? The blurred props are at the very end of the Hierarchy.
It might be part order indeed. I thought GMax did some ordering on export, maybe I have to do that in MCX as well. Let me see if I can reproduce this.
2. The custom visibility tags I created in the FSX ModelDef file have not been carried over into the FS9 model, and they do not work. The parts show None for the Visibility Condition in the Hierarchy Editor. For example, the chocks never disappear when the engines start. I do have FS9 versions in my makemodel.parts.xml file, but I don't think you read that? My XML file is also renamed mkmodel.parts.xml, since I use MDL Commander and Middleman to export from GMAX. If I Import the converted FS9 model, add the visibility tags in the Hierarchy Editor, and Export as an FS9 model the visibility tags are lost again.
That is interesting. When I go from FS2004 -> FS2004 they are kept fine. So I would have to check what is different with them in the FSX model that you are loading here. I don't have your FSX DC-6B at the moment, I'll get that model. Could it be the visibility conditions is on the same node as an animation?
3. One time the Emissive Mode in the FS9 converted aircraft was set to Blend for most materials, which lead to transparency at night in the areas with a black LightMap alpha channel. Changing this to AdditiveNightOnlyUserControlled fixed this. The other times it was set to Additive, which seems to work fine. Perhaps that is enough for FS9 - the other variants of the Additive blend might be ignored?
The way the FS2004 exporter in MCX now works is that when the emissive mode is blend (or a variant of blend), it will export as a nightmap. If it is additive (or a variant of additive) it will export as a lightmap. That was the best mapping I could think of. I don't know what emissive mode you had in the input FSX model.
4. The glass texture has a specular texture and thus is not transparent. Removing it fixes this problem.
You mean in the FSX MDL it has the specular texture already? But it probably also has the blend settings set to show transparency then. Not sure how to best handle that on the conversion.
5. Prop blades of props 1-3 (engines 2,3, and 4) only twist halfway. Prop blade rotation is OK (see below).
What do you mean with twist halfway? That only half of their animation is shown?
6. In the Material Editor the stairs_t.bmp texture is displayed as a plain gray square. It is displayed properly in the main aircraft display. It is a 256 x 256 BMP with 256 colors. This is also true in all cases below and in the original models (they are all identical textures).
That seems to be because the alpha channel is fully black. In the preview it's not used as it is used for reflection, but apparantly for the thumbnail it has an impact.
7. The plane has no landing lights, the Attached Objects Editor is empty. The original FSX model has them. The converted CV-440s are also missing landing and taxi lights.
Correct, I am not exporting landing lights to FS2004 yet. In FSX they are attached effects or objects and when I tried to export those to FS2004 MakeMDL complained. So therefore they are removed now. I probably need to use the special light name tag for that in the X file.
3. In the Material Editor the Emissive Mode is set to Additive, but that seems to work fine. Perhaps that is enough for FS9 - the other variants of the Additive blend might be ignored?
See my comment above as well. Any additive variant is exported as a lightmap to the FS2004 MDL file.
4. The prop rotation animations have issues. On the right side one (engine #3) or two (engine #4) blades on each prop do not animate properly, they rotate around the engine in an odd way.
I have seen that in some testing as well, but that is only the case when the engine stops it seems (or when the still version is shown probably). Not sure what happens there yet. I'll check.
6. The plane has no landing lights, the Attached Objects Editor is empty. The original FS9 model has them.
See my comment above as well. On import of the FS2004 MDL file you should see them in the attached object editor. But after exporting they are lost now indeed.
4. The Emissive Mode is set to Additive, which causes the lights to be on during the day and not controllable. Changing this to AdditiveNightOnlyUserControlled fixes this, although I much prefer MultiplyBlendUserControlled for lighting in FSX.
I have modified that in the code already as we discussed two days ago. So now the value used is AdditiveNightOnlyUserControlled.
5. The landing lights have been converted to generic light attachments using the effect fx_light64635A, and thus do not display. The FSX CV-440 conversion is the same, the landing and taxi lights have been changed and do not work.
How would you expect them to be exported to FSX instead? The BGL_LIGHTs that FS2004 files use are not available in FSX anymore.
 
That is interesting. When I go from FS2004 -> FS2004 they are kept fine. So I would have to check what is different with them in the FSX model that you are loading here. I don't have your FSX DC-6B at the moment, I'll get that model. Could it be the visibility conditions is on the same node as an animation?
The object chain for the chocks (for example) is SceneGraphNode/SceneGraphNode/ModelPart. All visibilities are set to None.
The way the FS2004 exporter in MCX now works is that when the emissive mode is blend (or a variant of blend), it will export as a nightmap. If it is additive (or a variant of additive) it will export as a lightmap. That was the best mapping I could think of. I don't know what emissive mode you had in the input FSX model.
It is MultiplyBlendUserControlled. As I said, it only became Blend one time, and after that it was Additive.
You mean in the FSX MDL it has the specular texture already? But it probably also has the blend settings set to show transparency then. Not sure how to best handle that on the conversion.
Yes it does, and Blend Environment by Specular Alpha is set to True. Blend Diffuse by Diffuse Alpha is also set to True. It's a popular material setting for glass in FSX. But since Blend Environment by Inverse Diffuse Alpha is set to false that probably means it is not set up for reflections and thus would be transparent. So I assume the specular texture should be removed in an FS9 conversion? But with the vast array of options for FSX textures I can understand how this might not fit other people's "typical" use of these options. Perhaps FSX/P3D creators could chime in? Of course once the model is in FSX/P3D it's relatively easy to modify these settings as one desires.
What do you mean with twist halfway? That only half of their animation is shown?
No, the entire keyframe range is used (0-100), and thus it twists over the entire prop RPM range (from full fine to full coarse). But it only turns about 40 degrees instead of the usual about 80 degrees. The 0 keyframe is the same (full fine); the 100 keyframe is only about 50% of what was in the original model.
That seems to be because the alpha channel is fully black. In the preview it's not used as it is used for reflection, but apparantly for the thumbnail it has an impact.
Actually the alpha channel is fully white when loaded into DXTBmp. But actually, 256 color images cannot contain an alpha channel.

dxtbmp_stairs.jpg

I have seen that in some testing as well, but that is only the case when the engine stops it seems (or when the still version is shown probably). Not sure what happens there yet. I'll check.
Correct, only the still props. I should have mentioned that. When the plane is loaded they look fine, but when they start to rotate it becomes obvious.
How would you expect them to be exported to FSX instead? The BGL_LIGHTs that FS2004 files use are not available in FSX anymore.
This is how they look when I Import an FS9 aircraft into MCX:

mcx_attached_landing_1-jpg.90326


Here is how I edit them to make them work in FSX as landing lights:

mcx_attached_landing_4-jpg.90328


Ignore the red rectangle, these are from my tutorial. Note this is performed while the plane is still in FS9 format - trying this after conversion to FSX is an exercise in futility. You cannot set the Orientation correctly (or at least I haven't found a way).

Note the changes to the File Name, no AutoGeneratedName, Orientation, and Position. Note also that these are attached to a rotating landing light case. I do not know why MCX changes the Position upon Import but lights attached to animated parts are often (always?) dislocated to the part's rotation point. The location when MCX imports an FS9 plane is shown at "Extra Unneeded Points" in the image above. It needs to be moved to "Point Centered on Light", and the orientation is rotated 90 degrees (green axis forward).

Also note that since GMAX requires a two piece parent/child landing light assembly, that would create twice as many attachpoints as are needed. For some reason MCX doubles that as well. So 2 landing lights becomes 8 attachpoints. I only use 2 of them. The AttchPointName is for convenience only.

Finally, note I use a custom visibility condition to turn the landing lights on and off (note this is from the web, I did not write it):

XML:
    <PartInfo> <!-- used for Attached Object landing lights - controlled by a landing light switch. -->
        <Name>special_light</Name>
        <AnimLength>100</AnimLength>
        <Visibility>
            <Parameter>
                <Code>
                    (A:LIGHT LANDING, bool)
                </Code>
            </Parameter>
        </Visibility>
    </PartInfo>

Note that taxi lights are controlled by the same code, but with the Name and Code changed (A:LIGHT TAXI, bool). But the fx_landing effect is used for taxi lights as well. My tutorial has more details if needed.
 
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Seems the option to export to 3DS Max (old)(*.3ds) has disappeared in v1.6. Is there anyway MCX could be made to export to gmax file format?

Greg
 
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Seems the option to export to 3DS Max (old)(*.3ds) has disappeared in v1.6. Is there anyway MCX could be made to export to gmax file format?
No, as that file format is proprietary and not documented anywhere.
 
Thanks for the explanation. Could export to the old 3ds format be reinstated to v1.6?
 
In older versions there was a second choice to export to 3ds format. That often loaded into GMAX more successfully than the current format you show there.

But if this current effort to export FS9 aircraft is successful that will reduce the need to resort to 3ds format by quite a lot.
 
I think the one in the list now is actually the older one, I dropped exporting them via assimp due to issues.
 
Hi Tom,
The object chain for the chocks (for example) is SceneGraphNode/SceneGraphNode/ModelPart. All visibilities are set to None.
OK, sounds like some bug in loading the FSX model then. Let me see if I can reproduce it.
Yes it does, and Blend Environment by Specular Alpha is set to True. Blend Diffuse by Diffuse Alpha is also set to True. It's a popular material setting for glass in FSX. But since Blend Environment by Inverse Diffuse Alpha is set to false that probably means it is not set up for reflections and thus would be transparent. So I assume the specular texture should be removed in an FS9 conversion? But with the vast array of options for FSX textures I can understand how this might not fit other people's "typical" use of these options. Perhaps FSX/P3D creators could chime in? Of course once the model is in FSX/P3D it's relatively easy to modify these settings as one desires.
When a specular texture is present the FS2004 exporter does indeed set it up for reflection and no transparency. So in that case the specular texture would have to be removed. Let me think if this can be automated somehow, but I have a feeling this is a very specific situation that might require manual editing by the user.
No, the entire keyframe range is used (0-100), and thus it twists over the entire prop RPM range (from full fine to full coarse). But it only turns about 40 degrees instead of the usual about 80 degrees. The 0 keyframe is the same (full fine); the 100 keyframe is only about 50% of what was in the original model.
OK, so it sounds like an issue with reading the keys in that case. I'll try to reproduce it here.
Actually the alpha channel is fully white when loaded into DXTBmp. But actually, 256 color images cannot contain an alpha channel.
Let me check, I loaded the texture from the FS2004 DC-6B in MCX and there it showed a black alpha channel. But that might be a bug in my texture reader as well.
This is how they look when I Import an FS9 aircraft into MCX:
Here is how I edit them to make them work in FSX as landing lights:
These two pictures are not showing, so I can not see what you tried to show.
 
Odd you can't see them, they are linked directly from the web tutorial. Perhaps the forum software blocks that.

When an FS9 plane is Imported into MCX the attached objects look like this:

mcx_attached_landing_1.jpg


The next two images show me editing the attachpoints so FSX will display them as landing lights:

mcx_attached_landing_3.jpg

mcx_attached_landing_4.jpg


These imaages should also now be displaying in the original post, hopefully.

These come from my tutorial, which has more detail.


Hope this helps,
 
I checked the stairs_t.bmp file included in the FS2004 DC-6B CB-16 Base Pack and it is 256 colors without an alpha channel, at least as reported by DXTBmp. Paint Shop Pro 7 also reports that it is a 256 color image. That file is located in the texture.united folder. Same for the FSX version.
 
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The next two images show me editing the attachpoints so FSX will display them as landing lights:
It might be a good idea to automatically select the correct FSX effect based on the type of light, like fx_landing for a landing light. That is something that can be done. On FS2004 export the reverse conversion has to be done then. I'll look into that.
I checked the stairs_t.bmp file included in the FS2004 DC-6B CB-16 Base Pack and it is 256 colors without an alpha channel, at least as reported by DXTBmp. Paint Shop Pro 7 also reports that it is a 256 color image. That file is located in the texture.united folder. Same for the FSX version.
OK, sounds like a bug in my texture reader then. I'll check that.
 
Hi Tom,

I have fixed the texture issue, that will be in the next development release.

I tried to reproduce the issue that you had with the custom visibility condition of the blocks being lost, but I can't reproduce it. I loaded your FSX DC-6B and if I check in the hierarchy editor the visiblity condition is there. After I export the model to FS2004 the visibility condition is still there. Did use a different approach when you saw this issue?
 
Hi,

If you load the aircraft.cfg file you are correct, the visibilities are retained. But if you load the MDL file instead and export that, they are not. That's what I was doing. I guess I have to get out of that habit!
 
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